The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Original 14" inch Edison horns usually have "Pat'd Appld.For" stamped in them near the cone base, and sometimes the year also (1905, 1906, etc.) stamped near the bottom cone area of the horn.., But some horns do not have the stampings, yet still can be original. In this case when there is no stamping, You have to look at the Horn Ring where the horn meets and is soldered to the cone. On originals, The ring has a defined lip area, and looks like an actual brass "ring" nothing like the reproduction horns. To really learn, You really need to see a bonafide original next to a reproduction so you can see the clear differences, but the differences are clear as day as long as you know what you are looking at.

Edison Model B's could have either come with a 14" Black brass horn or the 10 Panel 31"? Straight Panel Edison "Morning Glory" Horns which could have come all black or all Blue with gold pinstriping that came both with or without painted flower murals inside the horns.

Most Edison Standards after the "B" models DID NOT come with 14" horns, they came with the 10 Panel 31"? Straight Panel Edison "Morning Glory" Horns which could have come all black or all Blue with gold pin striping that came both with or without painted flower mural inside the horns that I just mentioned above. Standard "D" models and later could have also been ordered with a 10 Panel Black Cygnet horn as well. These were known as "D2" models because the reproducer carriage was different to accept the Cygnet horns.

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Tony K.

Edison Collector/Restorer

71769 wrote:how do you know its a reproduction? I want to buy an Edison Cylinder phonograph myself, and would like to learn more about the specific things you look for.

Here's what I offered to a similar discussion in August 2012:

Most original cylinder horns manufactured before 1905 will have the smaller end constructed with a straight tube soldered into the body. I believe the Tea Tray Company was the first to patent a stamped & joined small end for a horn (that's the April 22, 1905 patent we often see on horns). Others soon developed similar designs. Edison never manufactured cylinder horns (except for the Amberolas). Edison-supplied external horns were made by outside manufacturers such as Tea Tray and Standard Metal Manufacturing Company.

The fact is that not all original horns have any markings, patent or otherwise (in fact most don't). Not all original cylinder horns will have the seam running the entire length of the smaller end (in fact, very few will before 1905, with exceptions such as the small aluminum horns supplied for the Graphophones).

So how do you tell?

1) On the earlier designs where the small end consists of a tube soldered to the tapering section, check for the tube to be brass. Reproductions will often use copper.

2) Check the imaginary line from the tapered section to the bell. They should line up. Reproductions will often have a bell section that's a bit larger than the tapered section or vice versa. Look for that continuity.

3) Look down the throat of the horn from the wide end. Sometimes (but not always) reproductions will have subtle concentric lines in the bell from the spinning process. I've never seen these on originals (but good reproductions won't have them either).

4) If the horn is a larger one (more than 15" long), chances are it's an original. Some larger reproductions have been made, but I've seen comparatively few of them. If there's a question, check the hanger. If you've examined hundreds of antique phonograph horns, you'll be able to spot a reproduction hanger. Also, check #1 above. Check the construction of joints, soldering, etc. There's no substitute for experience.

You might want to read this earlier thread as well:

http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... ell#p88940

George P.

Thanks Tony and George for the info, I've come to the conclusion
that my model B does have a reproduction horn, but hey it is what it
is....for now anyway
at some future point I may get a morning glory for it.
Gene

Hey, Even the Repro 14" horn in good shape is worth around $40 bucks!

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Tony K.

Edison Collector/Restorer