The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Someone needs an eye exam and some new glasses!!!

I seem to notice a dive in prices of many machines. I think we have a surplus of machines, far more than the demand.

What will happen to the surplus?

Victrolacollector wrote:I seem to notice a dive in prices of many machines. I think we have a surplus of machines, far more than the demand.

What will happen to the surplus?

The laws of economics will determine the price and if there are no buyers then the merchandise is stored or trashed. My machines are 100+ old and have survived several of these cycles. I intend to keep them until I die and I suspect that they will continue to exist way beyond my life. The most hazardous time in the history of a phonograph is when it is initially considered obsolete. I think it's far more likely that the current survivors will continue on into the unforeseeable future. Eventually, our future descendants will have to go to a museum to see a phonograph so we are very fortunate.

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Looking at this auction with european eyes I realize what a difference there is between a country that hasn´t had a war within the country since the invention of the phonograph... also, somehow this abundance of phonographs in one place somehow creates some inflation though I´d love to go to the auction!
Isn´t the final price paid at an auction higher than what one bids too and if you want to be there in person that also adds to the cost and is part of the price of the machine?

Here in Europe I haven´t noticed a dip in prices - or interest for that matter. But then things are more scarce, probably a lot fewer machines were ever made here except for in the UK maybe, most people in around 1910 couldn´t afford these machines - I think I´ve seen one dog-model in my life for sale. China also seems to have a lot of interest now - and money for that matter. I´ve sold a couple of machines to China this year (to be able to buy an Expert!). The problem of course is shipping...

Victrolacollector wrote:I seem to notice a dive in prices of many machines. I think we have a surplus of machines, far more than the demand.

What will happen to the surplus?

if these stantons auctions were more mobile, or held in different locations around the country each time, I bet the results would be quite different, the sales better and the prices higher. and if location and the cost of transport and shipping weren't an issue, and you could bid and buy from wherever you were rather than onsite, I'd bet there would be a lot more participation and many more things sold for more. I don't think it's a very valid inference to draw, that based on the results of these particular auctions, that interest in antique phonographs and their relative values are falling... at times, I think quite the opposite is true, particularly with the resurgence of discs/records as a desired medium for music.

Maybe I was misunderstood. I don't think that interest in these machines is falling just prices. An example would be that if an Edison Stsndard sold for $200.00, after that people don't want to pay more than $200.00 for one because they can wait for the next auction and get it. I just think these auctions with large quanities of machines are driving retail prices of machines down.

Rich Gordon

Common machines have always been cheap at these auctions. This is where dealers buy. The rare stuff sells for high retail, the common stuff sells for wholesale, the junk sells for pennies and everyone is happy. On problem is that a couple of the big buyers are pretty badly overstocked, and so are not bidding as agressively. I'd have been as happy were I consignor at this sale as I was the last few times that I sent large lots off to Stanton's. He does very well, fetching overall better prices on a "per collection" basis that the other well known auctioneers of phonographs. Going to a Stanton's sale is like Old Home Week.

Phonograph prices are steady, I think. They dropped precipitously after the financial crisis and have not yet recovered, but they haven't taken the tumble of, say, music box or Orchestrion prices.

I thoroughly enjoyed myself, but tomorrow I have to unload the U-haul truck, the Tahoe, the trailer and the Jeep, tasks which I am not particularly looking forward to.

When and where will the results (prices realized) be posted?
I'm considering making the trip next year, now that I am semi-retired.

Thank you,
Gene

They usually post the results about 2 or 3 weeks after the auction ends. The whole process is a little old-fashioned and low-tech, but then again so are the 10% premiums vs. the 21-28% others are charging these days. And nobody can match Steve Stanton's intimate knowledge and level of cooperation throughout. He has two more auctions this week (before Thanksgiving) and one cannot fault him for the slight delay in posting the results.

I was delighted with my acquisitions and the preponderance of high-quality items was astounding. There was something for everybody, for sure.

Raphael

Chinese market for phonograph has not been fully opened up yet. Only way to do so is by propagating and penetrating all phonograph related info into people who are indeed into this. Most serious Chinese collectors are fluent in English and they tend to be very picky and finicky cause they are able to access huge amount of info through books and internet including this forum, which means you barely can't "make money" from them. Not exaggeratedly to say, only 40% of machines sold to China in the past actually went to end users and the rest of them ended up being displayed in antique shops or online listings.Yes, arbitrage is widespread. Why? Only a bunch of people know the truth of the real value of machines they imported and they set up the prices along with "faked history" which always adds favors about how rare and old those machines are to boost their sales. Some machines can even be sold for double or triple the prices they actually worth. If everybody knows the basic knowledge about it, I'm sure they will come to you directly by any efforts without being fooled by their fellows. They are more than ready financially than they'll discover about how much joy their money can bring to.