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JohnM wrote:Looks like "V NO 6" to my eye.

The Japan horn is the belled horn in the two photos.

Hi John:

Many thanks. I was saving up to buy another Victrola, but I think I'll invest the money in new glasses, instead.

Yeah - it looks like "V NO 6" to me too - - and I've never seen that before either! I could swear I saw one in the 500-range marked "Vic 6." Very interesting!

George P.

By the way, Bruce, did that machine come from the Smiths? It looks awfully familiar... Nice machine!

George P.

I noticed that "V NO. 6" is listed on Paul Edie's site, http://www.victor-victrola.com/new_page_2.htm as an alternative jump to the information about the Vic. VI.

The Victor Data Book makes no reference to that model number (that I could find) but does state that the lowest serial number was 507, and that 3,074 were shipped by the end of 1904, with a first shipment date of Nov. 23, 1904. Cabinet dimensions are 8" high by 15.5" wide by 15.5" deep.

Interestingly, the second style Victor VI, "type M," shipped between Mar 1, 1905 and July 12, 1915 has a low serial number of 178, with a high number of 13,720. (Were some serial numbers used twice?) That used a slightly larger cabinet -- 7 25/32" high by 16" wide by 16" deep.

The book also states that the Japanned horn was discontinued in favor of the #24 all-brass horn on Aug. 31, 1906.

bbphonoguy wrote:I can only guess why the horns came from Japan, but here's my idea. Is it possible that the horns didn't come from Japan, but the lacquer did? Black lacquer was commonly called a "Japan Finish" back in the early 20th century. Maybe it's just the lacquer that they couldn't get? As I said, just a guess.

I'm guessing that at least part for part of the short run the horns actually came from Japan. The reason I say that is I saw a broken one at Union some years back and under the black lacquer you could see Japanese characters printed on the pressed paper. It actually looked like they'd used newspaper!

phonogfp wrote:By the way, Bruce, did that machine come from the Smiths? It looks awfully familiar... Nice machine!

George P.

George, This one actually came from a certain Mr. Fabrizio. Do you know him? It was one of the first "serious" buck machines I purchased a couple years after college. (Tim let me pay in installments.) The Japan horn I purchased separately at Union a few years later. When I got it from Tim it had a brass bell "L" size horn.

It recently moved to the collection of a friend of mine (he paid me in installments too), after I purchased the one from the Smiths.

Very interesting thread, this. I can show you the twin of the metal horn. It is on my very early III. I think they are Zonophone horns, are they not? They are huge at any rate and sound rather good, I think. I didn't find it odd that the III came with it because the horns on the machines sold in Canada are a always odd in the pre 1910 era. (The thingy on the tone arm is my version of the Lifebelt device that the Gramophone Magazine touted in the mid 1920's. It's just a rubber hose, but it adds compliance to the soundbox and it does seem to work.)

Jim

phonogfp wrote:Yeah - it looks like "V NO 6" to me too - - and I've never seen that before either! I could swear I saw one in the 500-range marked "Vic 6." Very interesting!

George P.

Hi George,

My Vic VI has a serial number of 1083 and also has the VN06 on the ID plate.

Cheers,
Mario

Valecnik wrote:

bbphonoguy wrote:I can only guess why the horns came from Japan, but here's my idea. Is it possible that the horns didn't come from Japan, but the lacquer did? Black lacquer was commonly called a "Japan Finish" back in the early 20th century. Maybe it's just the lacquer that they couldn't get? As I said, just a guess.

I'm guessing that at least part for part of the short run the horns actually came from Japan. The reason I say that is I saw a broken one at Union some years back and under the black lacquer you could see Japanese characters printed on the pressed paper. It actually looked like they'd used newspaper!

Wow. That's something new for me. I never knew, before this thread, that some horns were actually made of paper mâché!

bbphonoguy wrote: Wow. That's something new for me. I never knew, before this thread, that some horns were actually made of paper mache!

Funnels used on Kämmer & Co. gramophones of 1890-1895 were almost always painted paper mache horns, see the earliest version below.

Very interesting... both the horn and the ID tag.