The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Uncle Vanya wrote:

thatonejohn wrote:

Uncle Vanya wrote:I'd strongly recommend replacement of the wiring harness. At thusvlate date it is an accident waiting to happen. A custom harness would be the perfect solution, of course, but perfection being the enemy of the good, a new unit made of Sundial Wire without the overbraid would do, and would leave you with a machine which you could safely leave plugged in.

Yeah, I am kinda concurring with that idea, nobody will see the wiring. It's kind of like upgrading vintage motorcycles/automobiles to be safer to operate, and as nice as the cabinet looks in that cell phone pic, it is currently not a museum piece as the exterior has been gone over with something to leave some drips/runs in the finish.

Well, Sundial has a pulley cord in green which is a dead ringer for the original Victor stuff. Add a Benjamin Swivel Attachment plug and no one will care to look at the modern wiring INSIDE your machine.

replacing the internal wiring harness if it is good would be a crime. That harness and the workmanship that went into it are part of the machines history. They do not move and are usually salvageable if you surgically splice
your new piece onto it.I have over 20 machines with good condition wiring harnesses. I am in the electronics industry so my knowledge of what is safe and what is not is more than just nostalgic.If it is mouse eaten then change it by all means.Too many of these things are being made into pvc queens.Yours looks salvageable to me.
A beautiful machine you have..preserve what you can using common sense..soon there will be no more left!

Well, I did that to a very nice Flemish Oak XVI twenty-odd years ago only to have a short develop years later which nearly set the thing alight. It was pure luck that I was in the room. I have been using antique electric appliances of all types in daily service for nearly forty years, now, and generally only retain stiff, original wiring in units intended for static display.

After my near miss with the XVI, I bit the bullet and had the wiring harnesses of my machines duplicated. They can be copied perfectly if one wishes. I then preserve the original harness with the machine.

The point about the original harness is an important one, but once (almost) burned twice cautious. I felt the same way about the paper filter condensers in early RCA Radiolas, using the originals in heavy service for years until a bad filter block took out the transformer in a nice Graybar 340.

If one makes the entirely reasonable decision to retain a good condition original harness, one might sleep more comfortably were a fused plug attached to the end of the cord. These things are ugly, but safe.

Uncle Vanya wrote:Well, I did that to a very nice Flemish Oak XVI twenty-odd years ago only to have a short develop years later which nearly set the thing alight. It was pure luck that I was in the room. I have been using antique electric appliances of all types in daily service for nearly forty years, now, and generally only retain stiff, original wiring in units intended for static display.

After my near miss with the XVI, I bit the bullet and had the wiring harnesses of my machines duplicated. They can be copied perfectly if one wishes. I then preserve the original harness with the machine.

The point about the original harness is an important one, but once (almost) burned twice cautious. I felt the same way about the paper filter condensers in early RCA Radiolas, using the originals in heavy service for years until a bad filter block took out the transformer in a nice Graybar 340.

If one makes the entirely reasonable decision to retain a good condition original harness, one might sleep more comfortably were a fused plug attached to the end of the cord. These things are ugly, but safe.

I certainly agree with all your points..paper filters are the first thing I change in all my late 1920s sets even if they test good but NEVER use electrolytics.It is a challenge using antique appliances every day but what pleasure they bring don't they!

victor 15-1 wrote:replacing the internal wiring harness if it is good would be a crime. That harness and the workmanship that went into it are part of the machines history. They do not move and are usually salvageable if you surgically splice
your new piece onto it.I have over 20 machines with good condition wiring harnesses. I am in the electronics industry so my knowledge of what is safe and what is not is more than just nostalgic.If it is mouse eaten then change it by all means.Too many of these things are being made into pvc queens.Yours looks salvageable to me.
A beautiful machine you have..preserve what you can using common sense..soon there will be no more left!

Ok, glad to hear the other side of things. I am new to 100+ year old wires, so I don't know what any of the potential material issues are besides the insulation becoming stiff and cracking. Would the insulation have held up over 100 years without cracking due to chemical degassing/exposure to oxygen/changes in environment/vibration, etc? I am assuming the wires on the interior have not been fiddled with and are not mechanically compromised, it's more the potential effects of aging that I am worried about.

It’s very interesting that nobody has provided any cautions about the motor itself.

I strongly suggest that if and when you power it up, you use a Variac to slowly bring the voltage up, and also prior to applying any power you rotate the motor by hand to make sure that nothing is frozen up. Lubricate the governor shaft and pads at that time, and make sure the governor is free as well.

Then as you slowly bring up the voltage you “help” the motor get started by gently nudging the platter with your hand until it finally gets moving. However, if you hear a loud hum or you smell anything or hear/see any sparking etc., you should immediately take the power off.

Another thing, is to make sure that the big resistors in the back are set up, per the diagram that you see adjacent to them, for 115 or 120 V AC. Chances are very good that it is set up properly, but you never know. One or more of those resistors may have gone bad as well.

It sounds like you’ve inspected all the wiring, but be sure that there’s no bare or worn or deteriorated wiring that might be contacting metal parts or other wiring - so that you don’t get a little shock or short anything out.

ThatOneJohn,

Note that 32 volts AC should be coming from the wire wound ceramic resistor group and going towards the motor... as detailed in the attached page from the RCA Service book. Also I had done a bit of investigation on Electrola wire size and sourcing that I posted on TMF at the following link:

http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... =7&t=36158