The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Zeppy wrote: As for the machines, if you're buying from the US, I would go only with a Victor. Even the horn machines were produced in such quantities that you will always find parts should something break. The Victor 1 you showed is probably a little over priced for the current market. I've seen Victor 1s go between $600 and $700. The only thing that made the Victor 1 on eBay a little more interesting is the horn adaptor that permitted using a larger horn than the normal Victor 1 horn (that part usually runs for between $60 to $100). But for that price, you can probably get a slightly better machine (for about $1000 you should be able to get a Victor 3).

And as long as you're going to take the hit on shipping, you might as well try for an external horn machine. The VV-IV and VI will cost you just as much in shipping as the machine is worth

Good luck
JP

Paul,

I agree with Zeppy. I also think you should avoid the single spring I & II and look for a III which has a double spring. The III will not cost that much more for one in similar condition and shipping would cost about the same for any of them. The III should be able to accomodate 12" records without the speed degrading. The II would struggle.

One more thing. If you have any visitors coming from the US or you plan on making a trip there, you can ship a III with proper sized petaled horn or brass bell horn in your checked luggage. You would have to pay for two extra pieces of luggage. When I did it, it cost $50 additional per piece. Packing is a bit tricky. You need to be within dimentions and weight, yet double boxed and packed tight tight tight but I know from personal experience that it can be done with no damage to the machine or horn.

Steve wrote:

Be warned, many of the HMV gramophones I see on eBay (the UK site in particular) are glaringly fake

I think our friend here is specifically talking about HORN gramophones? Most Table Grands, Cabinet Grands, Upright Grands and portable HMV's on Ebay are genuine, albeit not usually very interesting or saleable if you ever wanted to sell them on.

Yes, sorry Steve. I wrote that far too early in the morning where I forgot to specify what I meant

EdiBrunsVic wrote:As a small time collector, I like to go for the more common affordable models to start with. Your posting also interested me since we have done some genealogy and have Polish ancestors. Let me know if I can be of any more help with looking for a phonograph or records. Good luck with your search, and don't be in a hurry. The others who have posted comments have shared good advice.

Greetings from Poland!!:) EDI!! And thanks for Your reply! Of course u could help me! i didn't think that my post would end up being so popular on the FORUM. If You know any collector, who could maybe present me something interesting in fair price let me know! I've sent plenty of emails so far with a lot of interesting response:) Just hoping it will lead to my own ella fitzgerald record 78mm on Christmas.

Zeppy wrote:Wroclaw? Small world. I have family there (they own a pub by the opera house called Kogut, from what I recall). From what I can remember I had a great time last time I was there (I blame any memory loss on my cousin being tour guide to your city's finest bars).

haha!! I know Kogut pub very well!! Wroclaw is a students city:) We are having more and more pubs every year:) thanks for joining the discussion! ...and welcome Wroclaw again

JHolmesesq wrote:Be warned, many of the HMV gramophones I see on eBay (the UK site in particular) are glaringly fake. If you do decide to invest, perhaps let us know so the experts on here can verify it for you?

I'd love to show You what i've found. If You could help me make a decision I'd be grateful. I'm not in a hury, all i want is just to make the right choice. Maybe this topic will help someone else in the future.

Valecnik wrote:One more thing. If you have any visitors coming from the US or you plan on making a trip there, you can ship a III with proper sized petaled horn or brass bell horn in your checked luggage. You would have to pay for two extra pieces of luggage. When I did it, it cost $50 additional per piece. Packing is a bit tricky. You need to be within dimentions and weight, yet double boxed and packed tight tight tight but I know from personal experience that it can be done with no damage to the machine or horn.

I don't have anybody visiting me from the US at the moment so i do realise i'd have to pay for the delivery...but maybe in the future...You never know...i'll think about it!!

[hr][/hr]

What I'm found! and considering

http://www.gramophones.uk.com/informati ... pring.html
http://www.gramophones.uk.com/informati ... ramop.html
http://www.mechantiques.com/phonographs.asp (ARN-10) Victor V
http://www.windupgram.co.uk/25.htm
http://www.intertique.com/BNWNickelHorn.html
http://www.intertique.com/BNEarly.html

http://www.collectorsworldwest.com/lookup.php?id=239 Victor Monarch with Brass Bell Horn
http://www.collectorsworldwest.com/lookup.php?id=241 Columbia
http://www.collectorsworldwest.com/lookup.php?id=242 Columbia

http://www.phonophan.com/victorwoodhorn1.html expensive
http://www.phonophan.com/victore.html two springs

HMV for ca 1800$
http://www.wagabundo.pl/inne/gram/a.JPG
http://www.wagabundo.pl/inne/gram/b.JPG
http://www.wagabundo.pl/inne/gram/c.JPG
http://www.wagabundo.pl/inne/gram/d.JPG
http://www.wagabundo.pl/inne/gram/e.JPG
http://www.wagabundo.pl/inne/gram/f.JPG
http://www.wagabundo.pl/inne/gram/g.JPG

some ebay stuff :

eBay Item #180560781991
eBay Item #140455359512
eBay Item #120623271729
eBay Item #290476135183
eBay Item #280565100904
eBay Item #200522046456
eBay Item #230528730525 - > HMV
eBay Item #110584699990

VICTOR MS (waiting for details)
Victor M (waiting for details)
Victor III (waiting for details)
Victor III (waiting for details)

Situation changing , but I will try to using your advice make the best decision..

Thanks you for Your time Guys!!

Paul

Hello Paul,

You are certainly getting alot of helpful response in your search. That's good! I scanned quickly through the options you are considering and my recommendation would be to stick with a late Victor (or HMV) with a typically offered correct motor, (no pallard or something) prefereably a III IV or V, or roughly equivalent HMV with at least a double spring motor. It sounds like you intent this machine to get a lot of use so you want one that's reliable and easy to get parts for.

I would avoid the earlier Vic M, (motor too small & noisy) MS or D, (motor typically noisy due to worn gears). They are beautiful machines but most sound a bit "clunky".

I'd definitely stay away from Standard Talking machines and the like and Columbias, (increased record wear).

If you have more specific questions let us know!

Valecnik wrote:Hello Paul,

You are certainly getting alot of helpful response in your search. That's good! I scanned quickly through the options you are considering and my recommendation would be to stick with a late Victor (or HMV) with a typically offered correct motor, (no pallard or something) prefereably a III IV or V, or roughly equivalent HMV with at least a double spring motor. It sounds like you intent this machine to get a lot of use so you want one that's reliable and easy to get parts for.

I would avoid the earlier Vic M, (motor too small & noisy) MS or D, (motor typically noisy due to worn gears). They are beautiful machines but most sound a bit "clunky".

I'd definitely stay away from Standard Talking machines and the like and Columbias, (increased record wear).

If you have more specific questions let us know!

I have to agree with pretty much all of this. The Standards because they tend not to be very standard (spindal is larger then on all other machines), thus requiring drilling out your records or altering the machine...neither of which I recommend. I'm just not a fan of Columbias in general, so that's just a personal peference.

I can't really give advice on HMV machines. I don't know enough about them. Just be very careful when purchasing them, as most fakes tend to just slap the HMV decal on the front. Once you learn to spot a fake, they're terribly obvious, but again, keep an eye out.

For Victor machines, I actually own both a Victor 1 and a Victor M. I love both machines, but that's in part because I generally don't use them to play records on (I have a large VV-XVI that I use for the purpose of playing records). The Victor 1 really doesn't have the power to go through a record on one winding (particularly if you're very cautions about overwinding like me). My M needs to be serviced, so I'm not going to comment about how well it works. Also, avoid front mount machines (machines where the horn rests on a wooden arm rather than connected to an iron back bracket). These machines are very nice (again, I own one, a Victor P...but would never dream of playing a record on it), but they do tend to ware records faster than their backbracket versions.

Hi Guys!

I decided to write because I've found my first gramophone already -VICTOR V

2850usd incuding shipping from USA to Poland (on EBAY)

So… I'm happy ) and thanks to ALL!!

Some photo :

http://picasaweb.google.com/11572438918 ... directlink

I have also some questions

I put them in this topic - maybe someday someone need a guide from A to Z - how to buy first gramophone ever and and what to do when it gets.

1. Needles

Which needels are the best ?

There is so many… on ebay..

whether they really worth buying the more expensive ones? or this in normal price are sufficient ? http://cgi.ebay.com/300-LOUD-Victrola-N ... 0318744042 ?

I WOULDNT WANT TO SAVE MONEY ON them, cause I will end up having my records ruined. (so soft tones will be the best I think)

2. How strong should I wind up the spring? As strong as possible or just a little bit, to obtain full resistance ?

3. Restoration

I found this instruction, what you think Guys (I'm sure that you now that.. ) ?

The first part is easy and nice described. I don't like french polishing.. I prefer to not involve in originality.

http://www.victor-victrola.com/RESTORAT ... ain%29.htm

4. Cleaning

What should I use to for cleaning the nickel ?

Nev-R- Dull Magic Wadding ?
Mothers Polish
Flitz
Maas

5. Could I use the same to polish the gold reproducer ?

6. And about the oak cleaning ?

Is it good to polish it with 0000 steel wool and after use Kotton Klenser , or DOOZY ? I've seen some people using some kind of oil to make it more shiny. Is it Teak Oil or Howard Restor-A-Finish Mahogany Restore , Howard Feed-N-Wax , or MINWAX ?

http://www.howardproducts.com/restora.htm
http://www.howardproducts.com/feednwax.htm

7. Lubrification

Should I use :

WD40 ? or better is to use :

http://cgi.ebay.com/BEST-synthetic-oil- ... 4cf1a6b1ff

8. I've noticed that the horn near elbow is very delicate and has a some very small slits or very small cracks. Would it be good to paint it again with varnish - wouldn't it ruin the wood? Or maybe i should just leave it as it is?

9. There is a little problem with oak. When I try to open it. See on the photo please. But I will use the glue Is should't be a big problem..

10. Brake

Where can I find the leather piece that goes with the brake ?

11. Records

How you clean your records ?

Distilled water + wash-up liquid ?

12. Should I DO anything else ? any suggestions ?

I'm so happy! and my girlfriend is so jealous

Paul

you should really explore this entire forum a bit more and read more of the other discussions in this and the repair section. most if not all of your questions are pretty common and have been addressed at length elsewhere. and if you're really interested, you might want to pick up a couple of books on the subject... there are several out there that are extremely informative (and are also mentioned frequently in various threads on this forum).

Well for a first ever purchase I think you did pretty very well in terms of quality and price.

The machine looks quite original. I would not do much at all with it except rebuild the reproducer and fix that brake. Walt Sommers, Cyber Tiger on ebay, sells the needles and could also send you that leather for the brake I'm sure.

Congrats on your purchase!

You have a nice machine there!