The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

gunnarthefeisty wrote: Tue Aug 10, 2021 1:44 pm ... I don't know about height- mine was missing legs

The post I made above provides the dimensions of both cabinets, culled from the original ads which appear in Joe Wakeman's Brunswick book.

OF

So what have we learned here?

A Hampton with legs is taller than a Cortez. A Hampton without legs is shorter than a Cortez.

AZ* wrote: Tue Aug 10, 2021 5:12 pm So what have we learned here?

A Hampton with legs is taller than a Cortez. A Hampton without legs is shorter than a Cortez.

...Aside from the fact that the Cortez's horn is slightly larger--according to your post (and Kirkwood's), and the Hampton's cabinet is larger than the Cortez's cabinet--according to my post....

Because of the abrupt expansion of the horns' mouths, both horns are semi-exponential, at best. What I'd like to know, but never will, is the approximate length of the Cortez's horn. I've asked about this over the years, but have never gotten an answer. Based on the photos I've seen, I'd guess no more than five feet, including the tonearm.

OrthoFan

Are these direct horns from the base of the tonearm to the mouth in a 90 degree elbow, or do they have an enlarged path around the motor? The thing with true exponential horns is that you need a much larger run from the base of the tonearm to reach that horn mouth area, so additional convoluted pipe goes in between...

For Inigo,

Yes - these are direct horns from the base of the tonearm to the mouth in a 90 degree elbow - no convoluted path.

For OrthoFan,

An answer to your question. Your "guess" of approximately 5 ft is actually spot on. Using a dress maker's tape measure, I came up with the following measurements earlier today:

Tone arm - 19 or 20 inches.

From turntable deck to center of the bend of the wooden horn - 20 or 21 inches (straight line horn section - no bends)

From center of bend of wooden horn to grille - varies depending on path from about 17 inches (shortest) to 23 inches (longest).

Add the numbers, and you will see that 5 ft is a good number.

The Cortez has a nice, clear sound -- good on acoustic records and electrical vocals, but somewhat deficient on electrical orchestral recordings. Not very much bass.

Maybe designers at BB&C arrived to this shape of horn by trial and error. This could approximate any of the shortened exponential/tractrix formulas, so it is not surprising that the resulting sound will be quite good... The metal brunswick soundbox is good too, and the tonearm is also good. The soft wood of the horn will surely help smoothing the sound, and the quite straight path of the sound with only two main bends.I'm also thinking of the good sound provided by the comparatively small Amberola horn. The 5000 series videos of our colleague sound extremely well on his Amberola!

AZ* wrote: Wed Aug 11, 2021 3:12 pm
For OrthoFan,

An answer to your question. Your "guess" of approximately 5 ft is actually spot on.....The Cortez has a nice, clear sound -- good on acoustic records and electrical vocals, but somewhat deficient on electrical orchestral recordings. Not very much bass.

MANY THANKS! Another mystery solved.

Oddly enough, that's the same length as the VV-4-40's horn, based on the measurement's I took recently. The 4-40's bass is actually quite good, though not as deep a "rumble" as the Credenza's, which as you know has a six foot tone chamber including the tonearm.

It would have been interesting if Brunswick had pursued a more gradual expansion of the horn by inserting a conduit in the center of the horn, such as the type used in the exponential bullhorn --
That would have lengthened the horn and enhanced the bass output, but then again, it might also have dampened the treble.

OrthoFan

The hampton looks a whole lot like the two door acoustic Brunswick I had which had a place for a radio on the left side but none was ever put in this one. I wonder if its the same cabinet but with the updated horn?

larryh wrote: Sun Aug 15, 2021 11:01 pm The hampton looks a whole lot like the two door acoustic Brunswick I had which had a place for a radio on the left side but none was ever put in this one. I wonder if its the same cabinet but with the updated horn?

Hi Larry:

Is this the one you're thinking of?

See: https://www.ebay.com/itm/233189206438
It certainly looks the same. In relation to the cabinet, the horn looks tiny.

HTH,
OrthoFan
P.N.G.

Yes that would be pretty close. I purchased one in Kansas City in College from and Antique Dealer who said it came from a large downtown hotel. The cabinet had been painted to suit the lobby. Naturally like everything else I managed to sell it and later on actually discovered a neighbor of mine whom is still a good friend purchased it from the antique dealer I sold it too. They still have it luckily. A few years ago I got a copy I made of the grill pattern and painted it to closely match what it might have been so no longer the open horn as seen here.