The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

The earliest reference that I can find for it is May, 1916, where it is referred to as "new", so I suspect that was when it was introduced. This ad appeared in May, and I have seen mention of dealers receiving it that month.

One of these went to the garage sale on the show "Clean House" about 3 or 4 years ago. Don't remember the asking price, but I think there were no takers, so it went on the Charity Truck .

bbphonoguy wrote:One of these went to the garage sale on the show "Clean House" about 3 or 4 years ago. Don't remember the asking price, but I think there were no takers, so it went on the Charity Truck .

That episode wasn't taped in or around Tucson, was it? LOL!

http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... rt=0&hilit

Last August a unit just like it was posted here in Tucson for a long period of time. I did not save a PDF of the ad, but I recall it being offered for just $800. It had the same link to that piano site, except at that time the Apollo comparison to a higher priced example was active.

James.

JohnM wrote:

bbphonoguy wrote:One of these went to the garage sale on the show "Clean House" about 3 or 4 years ago. Don't remember the asking price, but I think there were no takers, so it went on the Charity Truck .

That episode wasn't taped in or around Tucson, was it? LOL!

I don't know, but I guess it must've been. After all, this is probably the only piano of its type in existence!

I'm confused, This piano on this link is 1912? http://www.antiquepianoshop.com/online-museum/apollo/. Seem this conversation is rude. Seems one has sold that is a 1912, and sold for 15,000 . Am I reading it wrong?

The Antique Piano Shop can ask such high prices because they have rebuilt and restored the entire piano, which is a costly process. An unrestored example is worth far less.

Guest wrote:I'm confused, This piano on this link is 1912? http://www.antiquepianoshop.com/online-museum/apollo/. Seem this conversation is rude. Seems one has sold that is a 1912, and sold for 15,000 . Am I reading it wrong?

I think that there is probably a 1912 patent date that appears for one of the components used to manufacture the piano, but not for the phonograph, itself. As noted in several posts above, the mid-decade would probably be correct, according to available patent information, advertisements, etc.

One thing to keep in mind is the fact that in 1912, the key phonograph related patents were still in effect. They were held by the three major manufacturers in the US market -- Victor, Columbia and Edison. Even though these patents would expire within a few years, as long as they were still valid, no company would DARE try to infringe. (Over the years, a number companies actually did try to produce their own version of a phonograph or talking machine, and they were immediately shut down.)

After the original phonograph patents expired--by mid-decade--hundreds of companies appeared within a few short years, to try to get their share of the lucrative market -- SEE: http://www.gracyk.com/makers.shtml

[quote="Guest"]I'm confused, This piano on this link is 1912? http://www.antiquepianoshop.com/online-museum/apollo/. Seem this conversation is rude. Seems one has sold that is a 1912, and sold for 15,000 . Am I reading it wrong?[/quote]


The sort of complete rebuilding offered by dealers such as the Player Piano Shop is extensive, time consuming, and hence expensive. When done by a reputable professional shop the work generally includes a new pin-block, new strings and pins, recompense harp, new sound board, entirely rebuilt action (new hammers, dampers and bridle straps, new felt bushings), complete regulation of the action, refinished cabinet, AND THEN the rebuilding of the player action. Re-stringing, re-pinning and a new pin block alone will generally cost about $5,000. A professional refinishing job about the same, a rebuilt action about $3,500. One may add another $3,000 for the restoration of the player mechanism. Note that the proper, complete restoration of a common upright non-expression player will consume about $2,500 worth of material and between 700 and 900 hours of labor. At these rates, the restoration of such an instrument generally costs about $15,000 when done professionally, though I've known experienced hobbyists who can produce professional restorations for about half that figure. One must remember that the amatuer is engaging in a labor of love, and is not really charging for his time.

This suggests that the residual value of an unrestored non-expression player approaches null, a figure borne out by the actual selling prices of unrestored instruments. At a recent mechanical music auction a nice clean Appllophone, in a Circassian walnut cabinet, with a still glossy restorable original finish sold for $725. Other nice straight players (Aeolian Pianola-Piano, Gulbransen, Krainach & Bach, Lexington, Farrand) sold for inconsiderable sums, generally less than $100. Reproducing uprights were selling for around $500, as were the less desirable reproducing grands (Apollo Art-Echo, Fisher Duo-Art, Kimball Ampico), whilst really desirable reproducers (Steinway Duo-Art, Chickering Ampico, Mason & Hamlin Ampico) were selling in
the very low thousands.

The market for players is VERY soft just now, it could well be said to have collapsed, and so instruments which are unrestored, poorly restored or are old or amateur restorations are practically without value.

JohnM wrote:The lady selling this Apollo player-piano/phonograph and I have been conversing by email. I am attempting to get her to understand that it isn't one-of-a-kind and that it was made after 1917, not in 1912. Although I have told her that I've seen probably ten of these things for sale over the past 40 years, she has asked me if I know where any more are and I don't. No one I know has one in their collection. There was one for sale on Indy Craigslist for months for less than half what this lady is asking, but it isn't listed anymore (of course). Anyone have any input on existing examples of these?

Here's the link to her listing;

http://tucson.craigslist.org/atq/2230868430.html

John, The piano went begging for $3000 on craig's here in tucson. I was lusting over it but already have a builder. It is nice looking but a long way from 15k. The flipper that has it now will probably die with it. I got mine for the hauling. Terry