My cylinder collection

[fran604g]

Clay, most record collectors have adopted a grading system that more or less adheres to the construct known as the "Goldmine" grading system. It is supported by the Goldmine music collectors' magazine and is described in detail in this link:

http://www.goldminemag.com/collector-re ... rading-101

Most collectors also use the "E" (excellent) grade and its +/- variations which is just below the M- (mint minus) category and just above the V+ (very good plus) category. Nauck gilds the lily in using gradations such as E-- to further distinguish a record just slightly worse than an E- grade. There is considerable picking of nits among collectors who use this system. Each grader has his own specific criteria that he follows when assigning the letter grades, so you have to be familiar with each grader to understand their tiny variations. But they generally follow the Goldmine guidelines.

Thanks for bringing that point to the thread, Greg! I've used that system for assessing and buying vinyl records. I noticed that "Croakinfrog" on eBay seems to use a numerical system that i'm not familiar with. My trouble really is in the realm of relativity. I really don't have any idea how good some of these cylinders may have been new, especially the seconds. How do we distinguish those? I have many Oxfords, that I assume were sold by Sears and Roebucks, but I don't know how to establish if they were "seconds" or not.

Fran

P.S. I see that there is a copy of Major H.H. Annands book on eBay, I guess that would be a good place to start?

[fran604g]

Fran, those 2m Indestructibles are especially nice--and with so many original boxes. Good for you for creating such a list. I've never mastered Excel, etc.; am just content with Word documents.

Glad your thread is back in your hands, BTW; it became a romper room there for awhile.

Ralph

Yes it did, Ralph! I was in the middle of some pretty crusty stuff with a couple of the older wax cylinders and got a little unhappy to discover the boxes that had shards instead of cylinders. One was Columbia, "The Night Alarm. Box, lid and shards. " that is the description I entered in my spreadsheet late last night. I was compelled to try and put it back together out of pity, and curiosity.

I'm not very good at that. lol

A little of my daughters Play-do'h!

Fran

[fran604g]

O Tannenbaum, # 15354 Edison Goldguss Record. Wish I had the box and cover for this one!

There's a few grooves of a second song recording at the end. I edited it out of the video.
Fran

http://youtu.be/HyQ9bKhF_iw

[pughphonos]

I understand the compulsion/pity one feels when dealing with a broken wax cylinder! I too attempted some years back to repair a shattered wax Amberol--but once glued back together it threw the reproducer wildly and would not play. I've read that there's a fellow out there (a dentist in regular life) who can repair shattered wax cylinders, but I believe it's a pretty pricy fix and your item had best be worth the effort.

[fran604g]

So I think I'm getting somewhere. I have everything entered into the spreadsheet and organized with Title, Artist(s), Manufacturer and Record number, Year recorded (as best I could find info on multiple sites and archives). I recorded all the data on the cylinders as title and went from there for identification. As it turns out I have an Edison catalogue I bought at some point from 1909 that I will go through for greater detail on the ones I have that are listed in it. I found archived copies of the Edison Monthly publications and various Edison Catalogues, as well, that I'll use, too. The GM's are pretty rough, as are the Goldguss'. I'll be playing and grading them, hopefully I can listen to a few of them! But, at least I have the Oxfords.

Great fun, a lot of work.

Here are some numbers, feel free to comment:

Indestructible:
635
650
664
666
682
714
730
745
899
901
909
978
995
1039
1052
1115
1159
1198
1222
1253
1288
1308
1330
1342
1365
1405
1444
1468
1474
1476
1500

Gold Moulded:
4029
4032
4035
5004
8133
8221
8247
8293
8398
8536
8619
8672
8797
8982
9169
9237
9244
9284
9297
9324
9325
9327
9387
9395
9405
9409
9410
9415
9416
9426
9436
9440
9446
9450
9499
9502
9503
9519
9572
9612
9617
9689
9733
9833
9864
9887
9913
9966
10517

Goldguss:
12125
12810
15109
15321
15354
15516

Fran

[52089]

Hey folks,

Can someone tell me how to rate these? Is there a more or less standardized concept that most people honor?

Thanks,
Fran

There are 2 more-or-less standard methods in the US. The Goldmine scale is primarily for LPs and 45s. The Vintage Jazz Mart (VJM) scale is mostly for 78s, though some dealers will use it for cylinders too. Kurt Nauck, for example, uses VJM for everything but brown wax cylinders, which he rates on a 1 to 10 scale.

A good cross-comparison of the 2 systems can be found here:
http://www.vjm.biz/78-and-LP-Record-grading.html

[52089]

So I think I'm getting somewhere. I have everything entered into the spreadsheet and organized with Title, Artist(s), Manufacturer and Record number, Year recorded (as best I could find info on multiple sites and archives). I recorded all the data on the cylinders as title and went from there for identification. As it turns out I have an Edison catalogue I bought at some point from 1909 that I will go through for greater detail on the ones I have that are listed in it. I found archived copies of the Edison Monthly publications and various Edison Catalogues, as well, that I'll use, too. The GM's are pretty rough, as are the Goldguss'. I'll be playing and grading them, hopefully I can listen to a few of them! But, at least I have the Oxfords.

Also useful is Allan Koenigsberg's book on 2M Edison cylinders that is based on the Deakins publication. One place you may not have thought to look for more info is Youtube. You'll find hundreds of cylinders there, including a nearly complete set of 2M Indestructibles. Also try the Vincent Voice Library and the UCSB cylinder collection, both online. Both are wonderful resources.

[fran604g]

So I think I'm getting somewhere. I have everything entered into the spreadsheet and organized with Title, Artist(s), Manufacturer and Record number, Year recorded (as best I could find info on multiple sites and archives). I recorded all the data on the cylinders as title and went from there for identification. As it turns out I have an Edison catalogue I bought at some point from 1909 that I will go through for greater detail on the ones I have that are listed in it. I found archived copies of the Edison Monthly publications and various Edison Catalogues, as well, that I'll use, too. The GM's are pretty rough, as are the Goldguss'. I'll be playing and grading them, hopefully I can listen to a few of them! But, at least I have the Oxfords.

Also useful is Allan Koenigsberg's book on 2M Edison cylinders that is based on the Deakins publication. One place you may not have thought to look for more info is Youtube. You'll find hundreds of cylinders there, including a nearly complete set of 2M Indestructibles. Also try the Vincent Voice Library and the UCSB cylinder collection, both online. Both are wonderful resources.

Thank you! I found Mainspring Press, too. I found tons of info on youtube, The UCSB site and 78discographydotcom. I also used the truesound database for my initial spreadsheet and edited it down and corrected errors as I went through my records. That was a big help and got my head in the game. I can identify cylinders a little better now, at least at a novice level.
Fran

[fran604g]

For everyone cursing me because I only put the numbers up, I apologize, bear with me, I am trying to devise a way to take the spreadsheet and turn it into a text document. lol

I managed to print something out, but I still don't know how to turn it into a document.

errrrrgggggg.

[fran604g]

For anyone interested, I managed to turn it into a PDF...