The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

emgcr wrote:Your photos are superb Andy. Do we know what the conduit in your machine is made of ? I was surprised to find mine made of cast iron but even with your excellent photos it is hard to tell the material.

I don't know - those photos were taken some time ago - it appears to be painted over. I have a busy weekend but when time allows I'll try to find out.

Incidentally, the reason I did not decide to add the superstructure with a hinge all the way across the back is because I wanted to have the option of using any EMG horn.

Here are links to the same two recordings played on the Xb Oversize for comparison. Please note that the record is a "swinger"---accentuated on the VIII due to a slightly imperfect motor which will be dealt with in due course.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4yCWIaNtx2M

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBzXZmAs92w

I scanned this the other day and thought I'd add it here. It's from The Gramopone Magazine , June, 1929. Frederick Delius is their star celebrity in this ad. Delius' assistant and amanuensis Eric Fenby writes of the EMG in his memoirs, so Delius was in fact very pleased with it. I have another ad which quotes Delius, but has no illustration of the machine. If you click on the illustration you will get a very clear scan.

Jim

In the rather wonderful movie about Delius "Song of Summer", the gramophone appears a few times...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vyy2SagDwcY
See
24:20
34:05
That's not an EMG Mark VIII though!

The sound of it is captured rather accurately at 34:05. At 24:20 it's not, but it's still worth watching for his wife's comments!

Cheers,
David.

I have somehow missed this thread. Great movie and it looks like an EMG Xb gramophone.
Here are some pictures of my EMG VIII Deluxe. I am very fond of all the Wilson horn gramophones, my personal favorites, even the Mk VI without a conduit is a fine machine.

These are interesting machines, which we don't see in the USA. I always thought they seemed slightly out of sync, since horn machines were basically old technology in the USA in 1925. However, the sound is great and the needle tracking problem of American machines was corrected by bending the U joint to angle the reproducer at the correct angle. Are these horns heavy? They seem to be huge in size and as mentioned previously, seem to defy physics as far as the support goes. I assume that they are made of paper mache...?

Curt A wrote: I assume that they are made of paper mache...?

Strictly speaking they are not made of "papier mâché" but of "papier appliqué". The difference is that mâché is composed of small pieces of paper stuck together---a method which is not strong enough to support a large horn whereas "appliqué" involves using larger pieces of paper---perhaps nine inches square or so, plus overlap---resulting in an end product which is structurally stable and which is able to support itself. They are, or can be, quite light depending upon the number of layers of paper. It is only necessary to build thickness until structural integrity is certain although some would argue that the thicker the paper the more sound-deadening the end result. Paper was used because of cheapness and its acoustically inert properties, the aim being to reproduce only what is recorded on the record and no other stray frequencies. The horn shapes were designed to strict mathematical/logarithmic formulae which produce a unique sound, sometimes referred to as "holographic"---the instruments/singers appear to be in the same room as the listener. It is this special quality which is responsible for the great following and interest in these instruments.

Great photos Chunny---many thanks. The deck instruction plate is interesting---I have never seen one just like that---any chance of a good photo of the whole label please ?

Wonderful to see a pretty much original de-luxe model---must be exceedingly scarce. The motor is presumably a replacement---but rare in itself ? The lid light is one of the benefits of going electric---very useful ! The sponge pad to take the needle holder when at rest is of note, instead of the later tonearm stand.

emgcr wrote:Great photos Chunny---many thanks. The deck instruction plate is interesting---I have never seen one just like that---any chance of a good photo of the whole label please ?

Wonderful to see a pretty much original de-luxe model---must be exceedingly scarce. The motor is presumably a replacement---but rare in itself ? The lid light is one of the benefits of going electric---very useful ! The sponge pad to take the needle holder when at rest is of note, instead of the later tonearm stand.

This thread is turning into a definitive celebration of Mk VIIIs - wonderful to see these Chunny, thank you! I echo Graham's comments and questions.

2Bdecided wrote:In the rather wonderful movie about Delius "Song of Summer", the gramophone appears a few times...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vyy2SagDwcY
See
24:20
34:05
That's not an EMG Mark VIII though!

The sound of it is captured rather accurately at 34:05. At 24:20 it's not, but it's still worth watching for his wife's comments!

Cheers,
David.

Thank you David for taking us to this superb film. Ken Russell, the great master, in black and white---very powerful indeed.

I think the first two EMG sightings are possibly of a Xa judging from the thin "knuckle" on the horn joint although, as Andy will testify, some early Xbs also had this feature, presumably as old stock was used up. In the third brief gramophone view at 1:00:10, when Fenby returns to the UK, I initially thought a Mk VIII with goose-neck tonearm could be pictured but, upon further consideration, it seems to be another make of gramophone altogether.