The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Having never seen a Lambert cylinder in person, I have a question. Do they have any type (at all) of interior reinforcing? Is it just the celluloid turned in at the ends that forms the contact with the mandrel on the phonograph? Later indestructibles had some sort of core, and of course the Blue Amberols had a plaster core.

Phototone, there is no reinforcement, but the celluoid is thick enough to be rigid. I never tried to measure the thickness, but I'd bet the Lamberts were made of thicker celluoid than the Blue Amberols.

Earlier pink Lambert cylinders are thicker than the later ones. The later pinks are thinner and are made from one piece, no wedges.

The thick pink Lamberts hit the market in 1900 and were the first standard sized indestructible cylinder (Lioret was earlier but they only played on his machines). The thinner ones like those in your auction began in 1902. They switched to black colouring, initially by using black dye rather than pink and then using black celluloid, in 1904.

Lambert signed a deal with British Edison Bell to produce cylinders in Chicago from Edison Bell masters to be sold as Edison Bell records in the UK. This began in late 1902, but the Lambert engineer William Messer remained in London to install presses there. The brown, and later black, Edison Bell cylinders were made in London - the brown ones only lasted for about three months between April and June 1903.

International Indestructible of Liverpool began using plaster lining to counter shrinkage, Edison Bell following suit from early 1904, and they also lined unsold inventory so you can find lined versions of pink, brown and black records. US Lambert did the same from late 1904, and lined versions of both pink and black can be seen. However this was at the end of Lambert's life and they are quite rare.

They formed a British company in 1904, using a celluloid sleeve but with a fibre core. The presses were initially installed in the Edison Bell factory.

The company was gone by 1906, largely due to exhaustion after relentless legal pursuit by Edison. The British patents were acquired by Edison, as were many of the US staff and expertise, all of which permitted National to produce indestructible records of their own in the form of the blue Amberol. If you want more detail have a look at the CLPGS Reference Series books RS1 and RS15, which you can find at:

http://www.clpgs.org.uk/reference_serie ... s_page.htm

I hope this helps - congratulations on winning the auction!

Keith

Keith, very informative.

The CLPGS books look like a little treasure trove, by the way. Even though I am a member, I somehow had not yet discovered them and have ordered a couple. Will likely get more from time to time.

Clay