The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

If you're a collector, you already know what it's cost you so why not list it at say ¾ of that price and hope for the best? It's not as though you have inherited it from Gran and simply want to flog it to go on holiday.

Phonohound, I'm not trying to be facetious here. I too am a seasoned collector and I have noticed when an item is listed with a reserve it automatically turns buyers away. I guess they assume the seller is either fishing (very common) or has a very unrealistic figure in their head. With rare exception, I have seen some of the most expensive (realized) machines start at $9.99. However, yourself as a seasoned collector.....you to would have seen this. Here's one for you......since you have a repro nut on your machine. I would deduct $1000.00 off. I say this because a record nut just realized $1000.00 and so therefore that's what parts "worth"....right???. Now add $50.00 for the cost of a repro nut, etc, etc.......

Done the math........

That's $1,550.00, right?

Phonohound:

If your really concerned about taking a loss, change the auction from a straight auction with high start, to BIN with make an offer. Whats the worst that will happen?? If there's interest, offers will be made and you are free to reject them if they're too low. And I think you'll find exactly what the market price is.

Edited to accurately reflect auction status

penman wrote:Phonohound:

If your really concerned about taking a loss, change the auction from straight BIN to BIN with make an offer. Whats the worst that will happen?? If there's interest, offers will be made and you are free to reject them if they're too low. And I think you'll find exactly what the market price is.

I have not even looked at the listing. However, in light of what Penman has wrote....... absolutely the best advise yet.

I think its fine to discuss valuation. I do agree with Gramophoneshane, as pointed out, that value is what the buyer and seller agree on. But you need a fair starting point. Also, values have changed, and knowing why is important. No books out on the subject reflect current prices. Auctions are tricky because in some fields of collecting auction is %50 than retail. This isnt always true in this hobby. Discussing value is certainly tricky. (Why aren't some talkophones worth more than common Victor's if they are so much rarer? Hmm hard to say) I think its important to discuss for those entering the hobby so they don't spend $1500 on a common Edison standard that looks fancy with a flower horn, for example. Also, knowing valuation is about a visual literacy. It means looking at a machine which could be common and understanding add on's, special reproducers, right and wrong parts, and so on. While its hard to put $$ on these things, knowing about them in relationship to overall value is helpful when trying to come to a common ground with a seller so they understand you aren't just lowballing, but pointing out valid points about conditon. Thats just my opinion.

The owner is fishing for information about why he possibly can't sell his machine but to me at least it's painfully obvious. It's way over-priced in the condition it's in, sorry to say. The cabinet looks too new and over-restored, the felt is new, the record hold down is new, there are no photographs showing the back-bracket attachment to the case to assure buyers that it's not either a travelling arm machine or a tone-arm machine that's been retro-fitted with rigid arm.

The horn paint is in poor condition, the tone-arm looks to have been repaired at the rear joint, the horn bell to conical section looks a bit 'off' - why is the joint not straight, is something distorted or coming lose on the joint? It's simply nowhere near as 'honest' or fresh as anything Firebottles sells. That alone doesn't make it a bad machine par se but it does mean that price expectations should be MUCH lower if you really want to sell it. I note it's still listed at $2,500 despite all the advice given here too, so I don't know what to make of it really.

Apart from all that!......

Research into recent examples of the same model has demonstrated that near perfect examples have sold for anything between $2500-3000. The market is not as strong as it was for even the better machines. Being generous, I believe it's value lies very close to $1,500 +/- $200 in its current condition. Maybe the owner should get the machine overhauled and completely restored to finish what's been started?

What says everyone else?

The refinished case, repro parts and possible flaws noted by Steve are a big turnoff to collectors like me who prize fine, original machines. These issues dramatically reduce its value.