The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Iva, I'm sorry to be the bearer of this information but the VV-100 was only released as a floor model and the one you have has been, as you presumed in your previous post, cut off likely due to water (flood) damage. The legs are gone as well. The good aspect about this is that you are happy with it and, presumably, it plays. Hopefully the records are ones that you will enjoy. I would offer a very gentle suggestion that for any future phonograph purchases that you first look around (search) online, buy some phonograph books or inquire here and compare the pictures of models that may be of interest to you with the pictures of those that are being offered for sale through craigslist or wherever. The seller in this case, assuming they knew that this VV-100 had been "worked over", should have informed you of what was done. Again, assuming they knew.

Doug

I think the owner of the Home may be calling it a model C because it has a reproducer that says "Model C". This is a common mistake. A knowledgable collector should know better.
Dave Jolley

FellowCollector wrote:Iva, I'm sorry to be the bearer of this information but the VV-100 was only released as a floor model and the one you have has been, as you presumed in your previous post, cut off likely due to water (flood) damage. The legs are gone as well. The good aspect about this is that you are happy with it and, presumably, it plays. Hopefully the records are ones that you will enjoy. I would offer a very gentle suggestion that for any future phonograph purchases that you first look around (search) online, buy some phonograph books or inquire here and compare the pictures of models that may be of interest to you with the pictures of those that are being offered for sale through craigslist or wherever. The seller in this case, assuming they knew that this VV-100 had been "worked over", should have informed you of what was done. Again, assuming they knew.

Doug

I've seen several examples of phonographs and highboy radio cabinets of the late 1920s where the legs were amputated. In some cases it was due to damage, but sometimes it was done in an attempt to try to keep the furniture "in style" - much like what these designers today are telling people to do with "outdated" furniture. The tall-legged console look went out of style in the early 1930s and unfortunately many people whipped out the saw and shortened or removed the legs on their living room furniture.

actually your not telling me something I don't know on the VV100. I googled the heck out of that..lol
however looking at it I find, it beautiful.

It was cut in half, the top was cut off the bottom cabinet.
The water damage is on the bottom 3or 4 inches up from floor.

I don't believe this one had legs....instead, had those metal coaster wheels. There is holes for those and they look original.
Nothing on the bottom around the legs area looks to have been cut off.

The side trim mold on the bottom part, I'm guessing has been knocked off in the years. It looks like side trim used to be there.

They did a wonderful job of cutting it..if that is what happened. can't see the cut marks..it's level and there is a piece of wood that is between the top and bottom that sets down inside the bottom half to make the table smooth across. It all seems to match and looks like it was made to do that.

In the 46 years I've been here...I've never come across one for sale. I found this one in Washington. around here ya have to "know someone".

Looking at the VV100..it's a wonderful piece to me. under the lid everything is very pretty..no large nicks in the metal arm. Even though it's just a floor model and maybe not a sought after item.that will not change how I much like it. When I first got it home I was all excited about refinishing it. Now I just want to get the dirt off and leave it alone. I got some large gold wheels...sounds bad...lol but it does look good.
it really added to it, giving it back some wheels. again I'm shocked that the bottom stayed with the top.

I may have payed to much in some eyes...however the 400 records was what I was really wanting, and the machine came with them...lol and yes I know 1.00 a record is to much..but heck I got a VV100 too.

I still feel that I got a deal.
The guy I bought it from said he has never done anything with it. It plays wonderful but I know the springs should be taken out cleaned and re-greased. I'll do that this summer. I still have lots of cleaning to do and I think it will come out of it's shell even more. I couldn't even see it had wood grain when I first started to clean it. It was black...lol.

Discman...he said it has an H reproducer.

I'm calling him to let him know I wont be up today..the roads are just to bad to be traveling.
so I will meet up with him in about 5 to 6 weeks when he gets back. ugghh...

Here is what the VV-100 looked like from the factory before the legs were cut:

http://www.victor-victrola.com/100.htm

The early version is on the left and the late version is on the right. Yours appears to be an early version (1921-22).

I'd let the Edison slide. Just because it's relatively close and convenient doesn't necessarily make up that the guy is a little out of touch with what his machine is truly worth. Trust me, there will be others! Patience is the key when trying to find the right machine at the right price.

let it slide even at 500.00?

I just got off the phone with him.
I asked him what costs he put into it to make it so expensive.
He flat out said "I paid to much for it". Ah ha....so I told him that I have been looking around and his cost is high and I even said...your mistake shouldn't become my mistake. I told him I could get one off ebay cheaper...and in good condition however I don't like the idea of shipping.

He still thinks its a C model. I asked him for the serial #304426
He said there is no letters on it. (?????) I told him that didn't seem right there should be a model number on the plate or on the metal of the motor. he said nope.
He went to look at a model D and said that the letter is on that one...but there is no letters on the model "C"
I told him it just doesn't look like a model C but more like a Model B. He said those were on long boxes and this is a short box.
I explained the image of a model C shows a smaller box then the one he has. He questioned if I had a correct image.


I told him about how some people may think they have a model C because of the reproducers most times were C's. He told me the C reproducers only play either 2 min or 4 min cylinders. So he has an H reproducer that he thinks will play both, however he doesn't have a 2 min cylinder to check.

He was the artist on the horn and is very proud of his work. so I wouldn't change the horn.

I asked about if he was interested in selling anything else if something caught my eye. He laughed and said no he wasn't going to part with others just yet. In talking it sounded like he has restored most of what he has to his satisfaction.
I asked him about the box and the finish. He said he got it from an old bar that went out of business. The lady was reluctant to sell it so he paid high.
He said it was almost black and he removed the shellac and started to sand on it. However he said it turned white. so he just re-shellac it and became dark again. He asked if I planned to refinish it. I told him " I don't know how to say this..but yea I might. The shiny finish seems to much and they were not that shiny originally. He said "Sure they were...but after years of being touched the shine goes away.

I admit in seeing lots of these with a shine in ebay.

He told me he's had calls on this but no one shows up so he hasn't been real serious about it when people call anymore and he wont take offers over the phone. He said he would throw in 10 cylinders.
He sounds more ready to make some kind of a deal as he said I haven't gotten an offer out there yet and he/nor I like to do one on the phone. I don't want to insult him but I was going to see about 500.00.

So should I still pass it up for 500.00 with 10 cylinders?

I'd wait a while.

It's no bargain form the sounds of it, and if he has no takers, he might ease on the price.

If it comes into the $300 - $400 range, then you might seriously consider it.


Just my two-cents worth...

zenith82 wrote:Here is what the VV-100 looked like from the factory before the legs were cut:

http://www.victor-victrola.com/100.htm

The early version is on the left and the late version is on the right. Yours appears to be an early version (1921-22).

I'd let the Edison slide. Just because it's relatively close and convenient doesn't necessarily make up that the guy is a little out of touch with what his machine is truly worth. Trust me, there will be others! Patience is the key when trying to find the right machine at the right price.

I've looked that page over a few times in my searches.

I do have an early model.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/montanalife/10220090615/

I had wondered if they started out with a box bottom without wooden legs but had coaster wheels.
It all seems to be the same old wood on the bottom. metal pieces in the corners holding things together with metal wheel holders.

I've looked the image over a few times. IF the legs were taken off, the whole form of the bottom piece that include the legs would of had to been removed. other wise I would have some trim edges. If they took off that form they had to add something to hold the doors on.
I think mine may of had a flat regular no thrills cabinet. I can see that the side corner trim as been removed with no damage to the corners of the cabinet. which would of matched up with the top side trims.
I realize it was cut in half..but I'm not sure the legs were cut off or if it just lost the coasters.

I been look at different ones online and imagine cutting one in half right below the top cabinet doors. It just doesn't seem one could do it and still have the space that I have on mine.
Some people are crafty...who knows how they could of redone it after getting it home huh...lol

Down to 400.00? yikes even with cylinders?

De Soto Frank wrote:I'd wait a while.

It's no bargain form the sounds of it, and if he has no takers, he might ease on the price.

That's my thoughts exactly and by him admitting that no one else has even shown up to look at it should send the message that he has it priced too high. Because he paid too much for it x years ago has no bearing on what the price for it today is. With 10 cylinders included, I wouldn't go any higher than maybe 400-450 if the cylinders are in good condition. HOWEVER, by him saying there is no plate with a model on it sends up a red flag. It almost makes me wonder if it might have been assembled from parts.

The shine. A lot of people tend to over-restore things. Some like it that way, some don't. I would describe the original shellac finish that would have been on these as more of a glow than a shine. Remember, these were mass produced items and Edison wasn't going to pay someone to hand buff each one to a piano finish, as that person's time would have eaten into the profit margins too much. Also, they wouldn't have used a high shine finish like 2 or 3 pound cut shellac, as it would have been more costly. Most of the working man's machines I've seen look like they were finished with a 1 pound cut. By working man's machine, I mean the lower end to middle of the road machines that were the best sellers. The higher end machines had more expensive finishes.

I asked him for the serial number #304426

Anyone have any ideas? I'm also thinking it's a B

I don't know where on the plate it would have the Model letter.
looking at some online I don't see Model letters on them either.

So is it on the motor it's self? I know some of you have said the letter should be on the plate. His model has a plate and serial number. But no letter. Is it possible he painted over it?