The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Django wrote:Regarding the crushed horn, maybe I am missing something here. I see a large box with bubble wrap and what appears to be styrofoam. The box appears to have been smashed. Unless the seller had crated the horn, I think that it still would have been badly damaged due to mishandling, and not the fault of the seller. As I said, maybe I am missing something. We don’t necessarily enjoy seeing complete machines parted out, but that doesn’t mean that the seller is an evil person or an idiot. Parting out an extremely rare or unique machine would be a terrible waste. Parting out a common, but still desirable machine is an opportunity for others to complete a machine. If you are looking for a part that is made available, it is a welcome site.

I agree - the packing was not the best, but the box was a reused and very heavy extra thick international shipping carton, the type that is put together with staplers not tape. The horn was well wrapped in bubble wrap and supported with an assortment of lumps of styrofoam. Not ideal but I believe it would have survived fine if not for it's mishap. I believe it either had something extremely heavy dropped on it, or it got stuck between something else and some machinery e.g a truck reversing into a roll cage of packages or similar. I think that any packaging short of a wooden crate would not have survived. A wooden crate of that size shipped from Montana to Vermont would have cost close to $600 (I researched when looking for options on another horn)

This seller, whatever you think of his parting out - and like most of you I dont think he should do it - did the right thing. I sent him pictures and his first response to me was "oh that's no good at all, send me some high res pics directly so I can file a claim and I will refund you immediately" He did so, no further questions asked. I got a full refund of the auction price and shipping within an hour of reaching out to him. He did not try to dicker over the fact the horn elbow was shipped separately so not damaged, he did not expect me to return the damaged horn, or try to claim I needed to take it up with the shipper (like a record seller did just this week) - he just refunded me in full and apologized for the loss

mick_vt wrote:

Django wrote:Regarding the crushed horn, maybe I am missing something here. I see a large box with bubble wrap and what appears to be styrofoam. The box appears to have been smashed. Unless the seller had crated the horn, I think that it still would have been badly damaged due to mishandling, and not the fault of the seller. As I said, maybe I am missing something. We don’t necessarily enjoy seeing complete machines parted out, but that doesn’t mean that the seller is an evil person or an idiot. Parting out an extremely rare or unique machine would be a terrible waste. Parting out a common, but still desirable machine is an opportunity for others to complete a machine. If you are looking for a part that is made available, it is a welcome site.

I agree - the packing was not the best, but the box was a reused and very heavy extra thick international shipping carton, the type that is put together with staplers not tape. The horn was well wrapped in bubble wrap and supported with an assortment of lumps of styrofoam. Not ideal but I believe it would have survived fine if not for it's mishap. I believe it either had something extremely heavy dropped on it, or it got stuck between something else and some machinery e.g a truck reversing into a roll cage of packages or similar. I think that any packaging short of a wooden crate would not have survived. A wooden crate of that size shipped from Montana to Vermont would have cost close to $600 (I researched when looking for options on another horn)

This seller, whatever you think of his parting out - and like most of you I dont think he should do it - did the right thing. I sent him pictures and his first response to me was "oh that's no good at all, send me some high res pics directly so I can file a claim and I will refund you immediately" He did so, no further questions asked. I got a full refund of the auction price and shipping within an hour of reaching out to him. He did not try to dicker over the fact the horn elbow was shipped separately so not damaged, he did not expect me to return the damaged horn, or try to claim I needed to take it up with the shipper (like a record seller did just this week) - he just refunded me in full and apologized for the loss

That's exceptional! Very happy for you that it ended as it did. I had a similar experience with the seller of a nice old Zenith radio in a bakelite cabinet. He did an excellent job of packing, but...

Good to hear that the seller was an honest guy, not an idiot (even though parting out that machine seemed idiotic) and that the fault was totally the shipper's... When I looked at that horn, it just made me cringe and I thought of things that had been shipped to me in a haphazard manner, which was totally the seller's fault. How about needle tins or records shipped in an envelope?

If the shipper was UPS, then that answers the question. I had a Fairy phonograph lamp shipped by UPS to me in a huge box, well packed and marked in huge letters - FRAGILE - THIS END UP. It was in excellent condition, found in an attic and was all original when it left... When it arrived, the box was beat and upside down, in spite of the large arrows showing the right side up. Needless to say, it was almost totalled, the arms were bent and the wood horn inside the base was completely destroyed. I often joke that UPS tests the integrity of shipments by running over them with Hi-Lows...

How refreshing to hear about a seller who is so customer-oriented. Kudos to him. I don't approve of him parting out good complete machines but he has at least one redeeming quality.

As for UPS, I find it telling that if you insure your collection(s) with Collectibles Insurance Group, they cover items in shipment (incoming or outgoing), as long as they are signature-required, and go by any service except UPS. Fedex, mail, freight, whatever. All good. But UPS: no coverage.

I'm sure that rule came out of painful experience.

TinfoilPhono wrote:How refreshing to hear about a seller who is so customer-oriented. Kudos to him. I don't approve of him parting out good complete machines but he has at least one redeeming quality.

As for UPS, I find it telling that if you insure your collection(s) with Collectibles Insurance Group, they cover items in shipment (incoming or outgoing), as long as they are signature-required, and go by any service except UPS. Fedex, mail, freight, whatever. All good. But UPS: no coverage.

I'm sure that rule came out of painful experience.

UPS could ruin an anvil. Years ago, they dropped and destroyed a VW Vanagon Syncro rebuilt transmission that was in a wooden crate. The transmission was wrapped in plastic and the crate filled with expanding foam (like "Great Stuff") all around it. They must have "dropped it" from the rooftop.

gramophone-georg wrote:

TinfoilPhono wrote:How refreshing to hear about a seller who is so customer-oriented. Kudos to him. I don't approve of him parting out good complete machines but he has at least one redeeming quality.

As for UPS, I find it telling that if you insure your collection(s) with Collectibles Insurance Group, they cover items in shipment (incoming or outgoing), as long as they are signature-required, and go by any service except UPS. Fedex, mail, freight, whatever. All good. But UPS: no coverage.

I'm sure that rule came out of painful experience.

UPS could ruin an anvil. Years ago, they dropped and destroyed a VW Vanagon Syncro rebuilt transmission that was in a wooden crate. The transmission was wrapped in plastic and the crate filled with expanding foam (like "Great Stuff") all around it. They must have "dropped it" from the rooftop.

Vanagon Syncros are so freaking cool. A Cali-plated one recently appeared on my block, sat for weeks, and is now gone. Ahh the lure of adventure ...