The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Starkton wrote:
With reference to the serial number, noted on the second hand license, I am surprised that Victor delivered at least 1643 Victor VI in the first few weeks!

According to "The Victor Data Book", the Vic.6's "shipped after" Nov.23 1904 but before March 1st 1905 were equipped with the bevel gear motor. After March 1st, Vic.6's seem to have been shipped with spiral gear motors installed.
The earliest of these bevel gear motors had a ball bearing race under the turn table (see below).

This bearing race is quite interesting in it's design. Victor placed a thick felt ring under both the upper & lower plates the bearing race runs between. I assume a form of sound reduction... .


Also, according to the Data Book, the serial number sequencing started at 507 for the Vic.6 that were "shipped" (there are examples known with lower numbers. If this is correct, then my #1643 is really only the 1136th machine numbered "shipped" and at least one priced at $105.


By the way, has any member seen a white Victor sound box rubber mount before. This is solid white throughout. Not black discolored with age.

Just curious if the white rubber was only used on a #10..??.

gramophone78 wrote:
According to "The Victor Data Book", the Vic.6's manufactured from Nov.23 1904 but before March 1st 1905 were equipped with the bevel gear motor. After March 1st, motors had a spiral gear motor installed.

When I provided this information to you, I specified that "If your motor is the bevel drive, it would seem to have been shipped [my italics] after Nov. 23, 1904 but before March 1, 1905 - when the first of the spiral drive motor Victor VI were shipped [my italics]. If your VI #1673 is the spiral drive motor, the Data Book indicates it was shipped [again, my italics] between March 1, 1905 and July 12, 1915 (highest serial number was 13720.)" I supplied no manufacturing data. Mixing manufacturing data and shipping data is a recipe for inaccuracy.

gramophone78 wrote:The earliest of these bevel gear motors had a ball bearing race under the turn table (see below).

So, based on this information, at least 1643 Victor 6's were made during this early stage and at the $105 price.

The only way to determine if all early Victor VI sold at the $105 price would be to survey owners of examples with serial numbers less than 1643 to see what price was reflected on the sticker on the bottom of the cabinet. It may be at all earlier examples sold at $105, but at this point is is only an assumption awaiting further research.

George P.

phonogfp wrote:

gramophone78 wrote:
According to "The Victor Data Book", the Vic.6's manufactured from Nov.23 1904 but before March 1st 1905 were equipped with the bevel gear motor. After March 1st, motors had a spiral gear motor installed.

When I provided this information to you, I specified that "If your motor is the bevel drive, it would seem to have been shipped [my italics] after Nov. 23, 1904 but before March 1, 1905 - when the first of the spiral drive motor Victor VI were shipped [my italics]. If your VI #1673 is the spiral drive motor, the Data Book indicates it was shipped [again, my italics] between March 1, 1905 and July 12, 1915 (highest serial number was 13720.)" I supplied no manufacturing data. Mixing manufacturing data and shipping data is a recipe for inaccuracy.

gramophone78 wrote:The earliest of these bevel gear motors had a ball bearing race under the turn table (see below).

So, based on this information, at least 1643 Victor 6's were made during this early stage and at the $105 price.

The only way to determine if all early Victor VI sold at the $105 price would be to survey owners of examples with serial numbers less than 1643 to see what price was reflected on the sticker on the bottom of the cabinet. It may be at all earlier examples sold at $105, but at this point is is only an assumption awaiting further research.

George P.

Thank you George. Bad choice of words on my part. The serial number of the machine is #1643 not #1673.... .

I can start the survey off by stating I owned serial #1043 and it had the ball bearing race configuration. However, the licence paper was eligible... .


Although above #1643....
#4203 stamped "6" licence paper $100 bevel gear (bearing race not present)
#5884 stamped "6" licence paper $100 bevel gear no bearing race

Example attached: