The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Hi. First post and a dumb question from a juke box guy, not a phonograph guy.
I sold a vv-50 on ebay, Customer advises that the sprng is "shot" (his word), because he hears a noise when he plays it.
I played it before sending it out and it played ok with no turn table wobble.
Is it possible for this to be true? If so what is a fair price to refund to him for "rebuilding", (his word again), the spring. He is going to restore it anyway.

It sounds like the spring merely needs cleaning and re-greasing, and unless the dealer states that a machine's been properly cleaned and lubricated, then it's usually a given that that's something the new owner will be responsible for.
I'd guess that a dealer would charge 35-50 dollars for doing a spring. Sorry, but it sounds to me that the buyer's trying to recoup some of his cost by claiming this. If you're concerned about negative feedback, however, it might still be worth it to you to be done with this.
Other thoughts?
Bob

Thank you for the reply. My thinking is the same as yours. Just needs grease and cleaning. I think he is looking for a partial refund because I stated the machine played loud and had no mechanical issues.I heard no unusual noises, but I'm not perfect either. I played about 6 records all the way through. He is claiming this noise is a mechanical issue. I replied that a noise would be an audio issue. No response from him yet.
If he is going to restore it anyway, wouldn't cleaning and greasing be a part of the normal restoration procedure?

If he is going to restore it anyway, wouldn't cleaning and greasing be a part of the normal restoration procedure?[/quote]


Exactly, and it's mentioned frequently in posts throughout this forum.
Good luck with the buyer's response.
B.

It certainly is Mr Coin. I think every machine I've bought on ebay over the years was said to play loud and clear, but not one of them has ever arrived with a freshly cleaned & lubricated motor. That is something I do within the first day or two of it arriving. In fact, even if the listing stated the motor had recently been serviced, I would STILL pull the motor down and redo it myself, because it's the only way I know it's been done properly.
Unless you stated in the listing that the machine was totally restored, mechanically restored or that the motor had been rebuilt/serviced, then I would politely inform the buyer that the most likely cause of the noise is due to the old grease on the spring barrel hardening over time, and that the bumping noise has only become apparent because the machine is starting to get used again after sitting dormant for goodness knows how long.
I assume you sold the machine in "as is" condition, and not as restored or "new" condition, so any general maintainance is his responsibility, not yours.
The main spring in any mechanical phonograph can actually break at any time, due to age, being overwound, lack of lubrication, or even from a sudden severe temperature change while the spring is storing a lot of energy, so I wonder what he'd have done/expected if the spring had broken half way through the 2nd record he had played

From my experience in selling stuff (musical instruments) on eBay, eventually it will cost less for you by offering full refund MINUS SHIPPING and have the VV-50 back for re-listing on eBay later. It seems to me that VV-50 is comparatively easy to sell on eBay and if the timing is right, you may get more money by re-listing it.

Here is a line to the actual ebay listing. Did I do anything wrong in your opinion?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/271032487499?ss ... 1562.l2649

Auction
Antique Victor vv-50 portable suit case phonograph with Mah. cabinet 1924-works

I have an horrible experience like yours several years ago. A no-return auction (a rare guitar made by a famous luthier sold for ONLY $2200) got buyer's complaint. He simply did "not like the sound" (quote) and asked for return. At that time my reaction was just like yours. The result, my Paypal account was frozen during the weeks when dispute case was open. Eventually I was forced by eBay to refund every penny (including shipping, eBay & Paypal fees) I got from the buyer. When the guitar was back to me, it was full of scratches and eBay told me "this was part of the reasons the buyer filed complaint"! The guitar was sold for $1500 later due to the flaws on the finish...

Saying "No mechanical issues" can leave the door open for a complain if there's a small issue later. Best to go with something like: plays well but has not been serviced.

I do agree that the buyer is probably nit picking.

I like that....."plays well but has not been serviced". I'll do that in the future.

I told the buyer I'd give him a rebate and asked him to put a number on it and to be fair. If he gets greedy, I'll just tell him to return it for a refund.
We'll see what he says.