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When did Edison switch from etched "label" Diamond Discs to paper labels ?

Was there a hard cut-off? (year?)

Thanks !

Yes, starting in mid-1921 the uncommon white-title-letters-on-black-background paper label appeared on "flashes", i.e., records Edison thought would be hits and wanted to rush out to market. This label was replaced at the end of 1921 with the usual black-title-letters-on-white background that was used until the end of the Diamond Disks in 1929.

Ray Wile says 50813 is the lowest number disc originally issued with a paper label.

Thank you !

Funny thing is that the etched label is still there if you remove the paper labels. Not sure if that was only for some time, or on all paper label DDs.
Andreas

alang wrote:Funny thing is that the etched label is still there if you remove the paper labels. Not sure if that was only for some time, or on all paper label DDs.
Andreas

I've never seen an etched label under a paper label. Perhaps they did that with some paper label pressings of records that were originally etched? I could see doing that so that they didn't have to create a new master.

Most paper label records have only a plain surface underneath that the label glues to. (That is, until the label falls off as so many of them have over the years.) The record number is pressed into the otherwise unmarked surface.

Ummm...allow me to quote Ron Dethlefson:

"A point about early(pre-June 1921)Edison discs. Their labels were
engraved, not "etched." The Edison Co. took great pride in its
engraved labels. Before 1915, even the backgrounds of the labels
were engraved at 150-400 lines per inch which gave the labels a
steelish-gray appearance and made the titles on the labels legible.
This background engraving was eliminated by 1915 to speed up record
production, since very often record stampers were held back from
pressing because their labels were not ready. Interestingly, the
labels were bonded to the stampers with sealing wax which sometimes
oozed out from under the labels and into the run-out area of discs.
However, eliminating background engraving made Diamond Disc labels
difficult to read. Label legibility was a problem until the advent of
paper labels in mid 1921, but at least engraved labels didn't come
unglued!

"Pigmented labels were tried briefly in early 1921. These labels with
white pigmented lettering are often seen in the later 80,000 and
82,000 series of DDs. Colored labels were considered in 1912, but the
consensus at the factory, according to Thomas Edison's chief chemist
Jonas Aylsworth, was that the steelish-gray labels looked quite good."

NOT "etched." Engraved. Best wishes, Mark

52089 wrote:
Most paper label records have only a plain surface underneath that the label glues to. (That is, until the label falls off as so many of them have over the years.) The record number is pressed into the otherwise unmarked surface.

Mmmmmmm, that Edison quality standard.

Can you post photos of the different Edison (regular - not long play or needdle type) Diamond Disc paper labels? Also are there many variations to the engraved Diamond Disc records? I seem to have a few engraved variations which confuse me as to the dates of manufacture, etc. I even have a disc with only a number and the name Edison in large letters. (IF I CAN CAN FIND IT)

briankeith wrote:Can you post photos of the different Edison (regular - not long play or needdle type) Diamond Disc paper labels? Also are there many variations to the engraved Diamond Disc records? I seem to have a few engraved variations which confuse me as to the dates of manufacture, etc. I even have a disc with only a number and the name Edison in large letters. (IF I CAN CAN FIND IT)

I'm going to suggest that you (and other interested parties) purchase a copy of Copeland and Sherman's "Collector's Guide to Edison Records" published by Monarch Record Enterprises in Tustin, CA. The authors explain that Edison used masters until they wore out, which makes dating records solely by label type nearly impossible. It's also worth noting that it's not at all unusual to find a Diamond Disc with a different type of label on each side.

In very broad, oversimplified terms, the chronology is as follows:

Engraved: matte/frosted shield, shiny shield, bands/rings with Edison photo, bands/rings without Edison photo

Paper: white lettering on black background, then the "regular" label as follows: Edison Re-Creation without price, Edison Re-Creation with price, Edison Record with price, Edison record without price or "Made in USA", Edison record with "Made in USA".

The book will tell you how to look for more specific items like date codes, edge numbers, presser marks, use or lack or artist name, etc. A very useful chart is included to help you better date the engraved pressings, frequently down to an individual month.

briankeith wrote:Can you post photos of the different Edison (regular - not long play or needdle type) Diamond Disc paper labels? Also are there many variations to the engraved Diamond Disc records? I seem to have a few engraved variations which confuse me as to the dates of manufacture, etc. I even have a disc with only a number and the name Edison in large letters. (IF I CAN CAN FIND IT)

I thought a brief video might be in order to better illustrate the answer to your question:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7r4EjXoGQ-Q[/youtube]