The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

I am curious about something. I have always enjoyed collecting the off-brand machines more then the Victors and Edisons. But there seems to be more interest in these machines lately, especially on EBay. I bought a mint working tiny all metal Vanophone disc type phonograph last year on EBay for $162.00 plus $22.00 UPS shipping. The same model yesterday sold on EBay for $283.00 with a (poorly) repaired tonearm and replacement turntable felt. Mine is all original, very minty with all the gold stripes intact. I enclosed a photo of the Vanophone that sold yesterday. Just curious about the large increase in price on a fairly common but very cool little machine? I have also included a photo of a disc phonograph I bought last year that I cannot identify. The reproducer is marked New England Phonograph Co. but there are no markings on the actual case or inside, which is wood (oak) with a large steel drum sandwiched between the oak top & bottom sections. Four very big bolts hold the entire machine together. It has a small single spring motor and a small 9" turntable. Plays decent but with too much bass tone because of the large steel drum used instead of a wood horn. It's big and very heavy but can only play one side of a 10" record on a single winding. I would like to know who made this crazy looking talking machine?

I don't know who made the top machine but it is seriously cool and very interesting! Normally hornless models send me to sleep but this beauty woke me up with a start and then continued to pinch me for a long while afterwards. A fantastic machine you must be very pleased with. Congratulations on a great purchase!

I agree that off-brand makes can throw up many surprises and who needs another boring Victor / Edison / HMV anyway?

What's interesting about this odd talking machine Steve is that the big metal drum is nicely painted a faux woodgrain and the grille work is a separate piece made of heavy gauge cast iron. The sound in very deep and bass tone, unusual for a crank phonograph. It has a quirky speed control that must be turned all the way to fast (F) in order for the unit to play at the correct sounding speed. Unfortunately the single spring motor is too small as is the small turntable. It will only play one side of a ten inch 78 record. If you play a larger 12" record you will have to crank it up some more to finish the song ¾ of the way through. When you remove the four big nickel-plated bolts the machine separates into four pieces - the oak base board, the top oak motor board, the large spiral steel woodgrain drum, and the heavy cast iron grille. (Easy to clean and work on) BUT who manufactured this strange phonograph? Who the heck is the New England Phonograph Co. that is marked on the reproducer head?

Maybe people just want to have something different. Most collectors have many Victors, perhaps a desire for variety is driving it. I find Cheney phonographs to be very interesting (though I don't have one).

Where is the borderline between "off brand" and "brand"?
Is there just a big three; Edison, Columbia, and Victor; then everyone else is "off brand"?
That little black machine is cute, and the one with the wood top and bottom is definitly strange. I wonder if it was supposed to have some kind of cover that slipped on over those tall bolts?

I would add Silvertone, Brunswick, Pathé, Cheney, and Sonora to the "name brand" catagory, although not as mass-produced as Victor and Edison. The top of the bolt heads are rounded and slotted and finished in nice nickel on my unusual "no-name" machine. They run all the way through from the top to the bottom of the oak base board.

This wood grain metal machine was already discussed in another thread. Apparently it is missing it's lid. That's what those corner pins are for.....or so the other thread states.m

Perhaps "we" are the ones driving-up the prices on the non-Big Three machines ?

The appeal of the lesser machines can be both visual and mechanical. Cheney machines featured an unusual tone arm and horn and other makes had similar quirks such as the "Singing throat" wood horns on Starr machines. The Victor patent restricting the use of doors over the horn made most lesser makes use a fretwork grille and these can have considerable interest- my Silvertone has a very ornate cast composition grille which is a pleasant contast to the sobriety of the typical Victrola.

Off Brand doesn't always mean cheaply made either- makes like Aeolian, Starr and Kimball were produced by piano companies with massive woodworking facilities and their best machines can make a commonplace Victor or Columbia look sick.

I think the main players should also include Parlophone / Lindstrom machines in general, not to mention Zonophone (pre-1903 anyway) and many of the other German makes.

Of course in the UK, EMG and Expert are up there in the Big League too.