The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Hello, all!

I have managed to largely complete the restoration of my Expert Minor gramophone. All that's left is the motor, which seems to have a broken mainspring. As a result, I have some questions.

1. Who made the motor? It's marked "GGR".
2. The motor appears to have a broken mainspring, because one of the cans fails to hold a wind, and there seems to be a loose piece in there. Where can one find replacement springs?
3. If a replacement can't be found, can the existing spring's ending be trimmed?
4. How do I even get the can open to verify the problem? I removed all the screws, and there seem to be pins in place that act as guides, but I can't pry the can apart!





3. You will see a picture of another motor. Can springs from this motor be used in the GGR-marked motor if replacements are available, or is there a way to trim the existing mainspring ending?





After all this work, it would be great to get the motor in working order! Your advice is greatly appreciated! Lastly, please find two teaser pictures! After eight months, I'm getting close to the finish!

Well done Garrett---the Minor is coming on very nicely and looks excellent with its polish and new horn.

The GGR 255 motor was made by Paillard and is both correct and first class quality. It is advisable to replace both springs to ensure even tension---have a word with Soundgen who may well be able to help. It may be possible to trim both existing springs successfully (depending upon where the break is, of course) but this would not be my first choice. The caps will come off the drums so persevere---old grease is very tenacious.

I have no experience of the 30R 254 but if the barrel measurements are the same, the springs may well be of use---but are possibly less long. Alternatively, if the mountings are identical, why not use the whole thing---at least until you have rebuilt the proper item ?

emgcr wrote:Well done Garrett---the Minor is coming on very nicely and looks excellent with its polish and new horn.

The GGR 255 motor was made by Paillard and is both correct and first class quality. It is advisable to replace both springs to ensure even tension---have a word with Soundgen who may well be able to help. It may be possible to trim both existing springs successfully (depending upon where the break is, of course)but this would not be my first choice. The caps will come off the drums so persevere---old grease is very tenacious.

I have no experience of the 30R 254 but if the barrel measurements are the same, the springs may well be of use---but are possibly less long. Alternatively, if the mountings are identical, why not use the whole thing---at least until you have rebuilt the proper item ?

Graham,

Thank you so much for the input! I tried switching out the barrels, but the drive gear is not the same on the GGR 255 as the 30R 254. The 30R 254 barrels also seem to be slightly wider. The barrel should open after removing the screws, right? I don't need to force those guide pins out, correct?

Also, if I may ask; were these motors built to metric or standard measurements? I would presume metric, but if they were designed for export...?

Garret wrote: The barrel should open after removing the screws, right?

Yes, I think so. Paillard, being Swiss, were metric.

I was able to get the spring can open, and we have a broken spring! Graham, does anyone in Europe make new ones in metric sizes?





Thanks so much for the input! This Minor is almost completely back together after what could be decades of storage.

As I say, get in touch with Soundgen who can, more than likely, sort out what you need.

Thank you, Graham! I reached out to soundgen. I'll let you know if/when I hear anything!

Nice looking Minor. Well done.
If you are going to replace the spring, replace both as it will save you a lot of time and energy in the long run.
When a spring is broken like yours, near the eye hook, I usually repair the spring. A simple search on the internet will reveal lots of info and youtube videos. Sometimes this fix works for years and sometimes the spring will break elsewhere. Worth a try.
Basic procedure is to remove and clean the spring. Anneal about 4 to 5 cm of the end. Re-drill and file a new hole.
WEAR GLOVES and GOGGLES !!!!

chunnybh wrote:Nice looking Minor. Well done.
If you are going to replace the spring, replace both as it will save you a lot of time and energy in the long run.
When a spring is broken like yours, near the eye hook, I usually repair the spring. A simple search on the internet will reveal lots of info and youtube videos. Sometimes this fix works for years and sometimes the spring will break elsewhere. Worth a try.
Basic procedure is to remove and clean the spring. Anneal about 4 to 5 cm of the end. Re-drill and file a new hole.
WEAR GLOVES and GOGGLES !!!!

Chunny,

Thank you for the advice. Would you recommend repairing the spring and redoing the end, even if it is broken off on the inside like that, as opposed to the end attached to the barrel?

chunnybh wrote:Nice looking Minor. Well done.
If you are going to replace the spring, replace both as it will save you a lot of time and energy in the long run.
When a spring is broken like yours, near the eye hook, I usually repair the spring. A simple search on the internet will reveal lots of info and youtube videos. Sometimes this fix works for years and sometimes the spring will break elsewhere. Worth a try.
Basic procedure is to remove and clean the spring. Anneal about 4 to 5 cm of the end. Re-drill and file a new hole.
WEAR GLOVES and GOGGLES !!!!

I've never replaced both springs on double spring motors when only one is broken in 38 years of repairing , and I've only ever had one back for a second spring . If you check out my blog http://springrepair.blogspot.co.uk/ I've copied Christopher Proudfoots book pages on repairing springs , but I have never repaired an inside break myself as described in the book , I tried it once but found it too difficult ! Outside ones are relatively easy