The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

I just visited Ron Dethlefson's house for our club meeting of APS. While there, I saw a common non-descript Pathé model 10 machine. I asked Ron if we could play a record and he said yes. When he opened the lid I saw four nice looking rebuilt reproducers. These were the older style reproducers, not the swivel types. When he put a record on I couldn't believe the sound! It was a duet with a soprano and a bass singing. I don't think I've ever heard such great LOUD sound coming from this era phonograph before. We were playing a Pathé vertical disc. And all this was coming from a modest looking model 10 with a smallish curved horn. Amazing what a nice record and a perfectly rebuilt reproducer can do!

One record on one machine could have had an optimum symbiosis in this case. My experience with acoustical Pathé's is that they are largely mediocre - the pantographic dubbing process and all...

I bet a Pathé master cylinder could sound great if one could ever be found.

My experience is mostly with American Pathé discs, and I find them to be inconsistent in quality. Some are excellent, others sound very dim. You may have heard a well picked selection.

Just reading the heading, I really did think this was a late April fool's Day joke.

marcapra wrote:... Amazing what a nice record and a perfectly rebuilt reproducer can do!

And there, you've hit the nail on the head. Not only perfectly rebuilt, but adjusted or tuned for the best performance.

As for best sounding records, so much seems to have depended on the care the recording technicians took. I've heard that the late Brunswick acoustic records were among the best of the pre-electric era, though I've also listened to quite a few acoustic Victors and Columbia recordings that have an amazing three-dimensional quality--room resonance, an audible spacial separation of the instruments, even upper bass. (I credit my Exhibition sound box, which was overhauled by the late Bob Waltrip some 20 years ago, for bringing out the best in those records.)

Pre- and post-WWI era Edison Diamond Discs played on a carefully restored Edison Diamond Disc Phonograph can also pump out plenty of "goose pimply" fidelity, and give you the impression that the singer or instrumentalist is standing right in front of you. Unfortunately, most pressed during the war have an overabundance of surface noise.

Joe

Joe_DS wrote:

marcapra wrote:... Amazing what a nice record and a perfectly rebuilt reproducer can do!

And there, you've hit the nail on the head. Not only perfectly rebuilt, but adjusted or tuned for the best performance.

As for best sounding records, so much seems to have depended on the care the recording technicians took. I've heard that the late Brunswick acoustic records were among the best of the pre-electric era, though I've also listened to quite a few acoustic Victors and Columbia recordings that have an amazing three-dimensional quality--room resonance, an audible spacial separation of the instruments, even upper bass. (I credit my Exhibition sound box, which was overhauled by the late Bob Waltrip some 20 years ago, for bringing out the best in those records.)

Pre- and post-WWI era Edison Diamond Discs played on a carefully restored Edison Diamond Disc Phonograph can also pump out plenty of "goose pimply" fidelity, and give you the impression that the singer or instrumentalist is standing right in front of you. Unfortunately, most pressed during the war have an overabundance of surface noise.

Joe

Agreed: I'd say that a good DD (either late 'transfer' period or the pressings from the '20s), played on a well restored Laboratory Model or Edisonic, pretty much blows the doors off other acoustic recordings.

That said, some of the early '20s Brunswicks have left me in awe of their recording engineers…


Bill

I collect both American and French Pathé disks. I agree with a previous post that their recorded quality was inconsistent. I think that is true for most labels, they all had good days and bad days. The best disks will indeed knock your socks off, but as a whole most of them are, well, pretty average, and a few are stinkers. Some of the 14" French Pathés are stunning.

The best acoustic records are the Edisons, particularly some of the last acoustic Edison disk records made. I just bought one in the 519xx range that sounds too good to be acoustic but not quite good enough to be electric. Until you hear one like that, it is hard to imagine acoustic recording could be so good.

The late Columbia acoustic process was excellent as well- those dime store Diva and Harmony &cetera dance band discs have a very forward and incisive sound.

Pathé did not make the best sounding records, but did produce the loudest. Their Concert discs, designed to spin at 130 rpm, outdo any other contemporary in terms of loudness, especially if played on the machines conceived to reproduce them.

Concerning quality, as some others mentioned already, it is variable, however the late acoustic Pathés, both French and US, were quite well recorded.

VintageTechnologies wrote:I collect both American and French Pathé disks. I agree with a previous post that their recorded quality was inconsistent. I think that is true for most labels, they all had good days and bad days. The best disks will indeed knock your socks off, but as a whole most of them are, well, pretty average, and a few are stinkers. Some of the 14" French Pathés are stunning.

The best acoustic records are the Edisons, particularly some of the last acoustic Edison disk records made. I just bought one in the 519xx range that sounds too good to be acoustic but not quite good enough to be electric. Until you hear one like that, it is hard to imagine acoustic recording could be so good.

Yes I agree that the later Edison acoustic disc probably trump the sound of the other brands. I may be overly picky, but to my ear the acoustic versions of many edison pieces are more satisfying to hear than the electric version of the same selection. Most of the electric pressings of classical things have a distant quality in many places and lack the up front excitement they managed to capture acoustically.

Larry