The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Okay, I know there is a movement to ban the Confederate flag, etc., so my timing is perhaps not the best. But yesterday I put on a blue amberol dating from 1920, # 3920, 'Henry Jones, Your Honeymoon is Over', having no idea what was within, and it had frequent use of the n word and coon. What other 'gems' should I be looking for that, from the title, are pretty innocuous, but indeed are rather juicy within? Al Bernard and Ernest Hare were the individuals on this particular cylinder.

There are many such early recordings. A common thing in those times. Fortunately those days have passed and now they are just curiosities uncomfortable to modern ears.

Clay

orpington wrote:Okay, I know there is a movement to ban the Confederate flag, etc., so my timing is perhaps not the best. But yesterday I put on a blue amberol dating from 1920, # 3920, 'Henry Jones, Your Honeymoon is Over', having no idea what was within, and it had frequent use of the n word and coon. What other 'gems' should I be looking for that, from the title, are pretty innocuous, but indeed are rather juicy within? Al Bernard and Ernest Hare were the individuals on this particular cylinder.

I don't think anyone is trying to ban the Confederate (battle) flag. In appropriate context, like a museum exhibit or even a textbook illustration, that flag is a perfectly fine thing to display. So it should be with these early recordings of "coon" material.

I did a paper on "coon" and "darky" songs in college and my music professor, while horrified by the fact that this material ever existed, told me it was the most interesting student paper he had ever read. He later told me he had intended to submit it to Musical Quarterly, but doubted they would have published it because of the sensitive subject.

We shouldn't ignore our past!

I wonder how the incredibly violent and racially charged Rap and Hip-hop songs of today will be viewed in a hundred years?

I recently discovered a DD copy of a broken cylinder I had: "Bake Dat Chicken Pie".

It's difficult to look at the past through the lens of the present, in many ways.

Fran

These cylinders and discs, are a direct link to our past. The whole thought of destruction of history;such as the present Confederate flag debate. It seems to me rather odd, since it is Democrats banning the very flag they created. What seems benign may be a catastrophic "Camels nose in the tent". They will start with the flag, and then perhaps pull funds for all museums dealing with the 19th century, or anything dealing with our eras of prosperity and patriotism (banning all 18th century colonial revolutionary items, as an example.) Yes I am sure that some of those cylinders and discs are offensive to some, but I have no problem playing them for the public, I do not change or edit history, leave it as it is, as the old saying goes "Those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it."

Okay, I thought I might be addressing a sensitive subject, as race is still a huge divide in this country, no matter what anyone says. So, mostly support from my inquiry.

Yes, we should not try and change or erase the past in the interest of political correctness. The confederate flag should not be banished to a museum only, I should not have to think I must 'walk on eggshells' if I ask an inquiry as I did when I created the post. It seems like, so far, the inquiry was accepted by those who read it.

So, now I ask again: What particular cylinders have you come across, much as I did yesterday, that contain racist language, but seemed innocent based on the title of the cylinder?

I have"You're My Gal"by Bernard and Hare both on Blue Amberol and Diamond Disc.Of course,they use the "C" word,which was the common thing.Well,how about what Archie Bunker on "All In The Family"called African(or black)Americans.That was worse.edisonplayer

Mississippi Mud is probably one of the later and more pervasive discs. I still play it in public, well, because it's Bix. And the "darky" lyric is really quite buried in there.

Here's one to look for: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwpNGopN1lE
Also, most records by Golden & Hughes have similar themes...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_t7pzoqap4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BMsQ_-JOs-0
along with Walter Kelly "Virginian Judge"...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MX_5bfUX1rQ

Wasn't there a BBC deejay fired for playing "The sun has got it's hat on"?