The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

i have an old berliner gramophone and some of the original berliner hand etched records. any help on where to go to find out the value of these. the gramophone works and is only missing the stop to it. my next door neighbors husband was a collector, many many years ago, he sold his collection to a friend but kept a berliner and a edison, along with a bunch of records, i have had them myself for over 20 years but dont really have any use for them. any one know where id find information on any of its worth. thanks for any help

no opinion on value that you get will matter very much coming from someone who hasn't seen what you have, so if you're looking for opinions here at the very least you'll have to post some photos. otherwise, check the completed auctions on ebay. and there are plenty of dealers on the web, try google or yahoo.

Brian is right. No-one could even give you a ball park figure without seeing what Berliner you might have. Berliners were made in USA, Canada & Britain, and reproductions were first made back in the 20's or 30's for dealer displays, and have been made in probably every decade ever since, in countries all around the world.
Even with a few photo's, it can be hard sometimes to verify these machines, as some very exact copies have produced over the years.
Because of this, you really need to determine where & when it was made before you can even think about value. Once that's achieved, then the overall condition & originality will play the major role in the machines value.
Even the records vary enormously in value, depending on the title & artist, and again when & for who they were pressed, their condition, and even what material they are made from.
Unfortunately, because these are the first disc machines & records, it's nowhere near as simple as valueing a 1920's Victor upright & a pile of Rudy Vallee batwing labels.

i do search from time to time but dont really find much on value, i have contacted some people that deal in the records but they wont give me a price but would like to buy them. i thought i could just find a site that would list really old records and their value.

Unfortunately, no such site, or even book exists for these early records & machines.
As Brian said, your best bet would be to watch ebay closely, and if a title is auctioned that you have, it might give you a rough idea.
In all honesty, if your intentions are to sell them, I'd do it via ebay.
You'd need to list each record separately, and provide a good clear photo of each disc so people can see exactly what they're bidding on. It would also be in your best interests to list them worldwide as you'll get far better exposure to collectors than anywhere else, and a better chance of getting top dollar.
Berliner machines & records are more common in USA than anywhere else in the world, so people over seas are usually willing to pay a lot more to get them.
Sending something over seas might sound like a hassle, but really it's no different to packing an item to send to the next city, and the buyer pays the costs involved. But I can guarrantee you, it will be well worth your while.
The main thing to remember with ebay IMO, is not to start the bidding too high. By starting at a sensible or even low price, people think they might get a bargain & more people will follow the auction & be willing to bid. Start too high, and most people will simply overlook the auction.
In reality, it's very seldom that anyone gets a bargain on ebay where good phono stuff is concerned.
95 times out of 100, the final price is exactly what the item is worth.

i understand what your saying. whatever record i try to sell is going to be worth whatever to whoever wants it. if two people feel they need it to complete there collection then the price could go high. just like the gramophone, if some one doesnt have this model then they might pay what ever it takes to get it. but yeah i have the had these items for over 20 years and dont really do anything with them and times are tight right now. good idea to list them world wide, i have been selling on ebay for a few years, mostly small stuff, but i can see where world wide would be better on something with value and rare.

again, you're talking about "value" and "rarity," but if you're unsure, you shouldn't assume anything. people here can probably give you some input about the phonograph, the originality of it and its components, and its condition (relative to what's typically found in similar machines)... not to mention the records. but you really need to provide some photos, and for the records, titles/artists and if possible, photos. without that, any reliable information you get here will be of a very general nature that might not even apply to the actual machine and records that you have.

thanks. i try to dig them out in the next couple days and take some pictures. thats my fear that i would sell a rare record to some one for $50.00 and later find out that its worth $500.00. there was a seller on ebay that sold a berliner record, listed as the rarest of the rare for $1200.00. i emailed him on the value of mine and he said he didnt know but would like to buy mine. i post some pictures in the next couple days, thanks for all the replys.

hotrod351 wrote:thanks. i try to dig them out in the next couple days and take some pictures. thats my fear that i would sell a rare record to some one for $50.00 and later find out that its worth $500.00. there was a seller on ebay that sold a berliner record, listed as the rarest of the rare for $1200.00. i emailed him on the value of mine and he said he didnt know but would like to buy mine. i post some pictures in the next couple days, thanks for all the replys.

$50, $500, $1200... the thing is, if you have a record and all you're able to sell it for is $50, then that's pretty much what it's worth under those circumstances - based on the timing, the interest of people who know it's available, how much they're willing to pay. but in just about every case there's probably someone out there willing to pay more, dollars or just pennies. you don't always luck out that way such that you find them, let alone two such people at an auction who keep bidding the thing up... and not every auction you see is necessarily genuine either, with the prevalence of shill bidding and whatnot, but you probably know that. the values of antique phonographs and records fluctuate at times pretty wildly based on a number of factors that people have discussed on this site and others ad nauseum, but that probably don't require recounting here given that you only really seem interested in turning that machine and records of yours into dollars and cents.

either way, this is why most any collector will tell you that antique phonos and recordings are not areas worth venturing into strictly from an investment perspective.

by the way, regarding that seller you mentioned who sold the "rarest of the rare" for $1200 (again, a disc title or more specific information would be helpful in this increasingly protracted discussion of vagueness and dollar signs) and failed to offer you a value for your record (again, you don't mention a title) but offered to buy it, for how much did he offer to buy it?

hotrod351 wrote:thanks. i try to dig them out in the next couple days and take some pictures. thats my fear that i would sell a rare record to some one for $50.00 and later find out that its worth $500.00. there was a seller on ebay that sold a berliner record, listed as the rarest of the rare for $1200.00. i emailed him on the value of mine and he said he didnt know but would like to buy mine. i post some pictures in the next couple days, thanks for all the replys.

LOL, yes, no-one will value them but everyone will want to buy them.
Like I said, ebay is your best & safest bet. I'll bet if that guy advertised his disc for $1200, it wouldn't have sold.
I wouldn't worry about sell a $500 disc for $50 if you auction them worldwide anyway. It just won't happen. Even if you started the bidding at 99cents, it won't happen.
The only way you'll get ripped off so to speak, is if you take them to a dealer who'd probably offer you $50 a disc or something, and then they'd put them on ebay anyway, or in another auction.
As long as there are GOOD CLEAR photo's of each record, so people can CLEARLY see the condition of the record & grooves, you'll get exactly what they are worth.