The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

I'm hoping someone may have a suggestion about this... I've been working on a VV-50, had the motor out, all was working perfectly... so I reassembled everything and went to wind it up, but the crank wouldn't hold, instead, when wound, the crank would not catch and instead just turned the opposite way and wound down. So I took the machine apart, had the motor upside down, looked it over and then wound it up... it wound up perfectly, caught, and played just fine... so I flipped the whole thing over into the position it would be when right side up inside the case and again, the crank would not catch, the crank would just want to spin back in the opposite direction. I'll snap a photo and post it if that may help, but has anyone encountered this sort of issue? It's really the strangest thing.

I'm no expert when comes to phonographs but, when I had the motorboard on my Edison S19 apart, the pawl for ratchet gear is held in the correct position by a spring (if I remember correctly). It sounds like the pawl is flipped in the correct position to prevent unwinding when the motor is upside down and when in correct playing position, it might be free hanging down to prevent the motor unwinding.
It might a good place to look.

Second Dwheels input. Had the crank on one my Edison machines unload after fully winding the motor, it turned the crank into a propeller and caught my thumb, very very painful and not a pretty sight from all the blood. I think the Victor has a "C" shaped latching device to prevent this....... The Edison machine had a spring holding the little catch gear which broke. Since my incident I never let go of a crank unless I'm sure it caught Cheers

Bill K

I'm familiar with that C or U shaped catch, I've replaced a couple in the past. This motor design, though, doesn't have that... instead, there is a round gear that seems to serve the same purpose... and it doesn't seem to move in any way that would allow it to hold a wind when upside down, but not when right side up. I'll snap a couple of photos when I get home.

Brian, My apologizes if what I ask seems stupid. I'm wondering if the cranking gear that the pawls lock onto is on backwards...??.

Here are some photos.

It seems you're missing something. There should be a ratchet and pawl somewhere in the winding assembly.

Bill

Isn't that the winding pawl underneath the large copper coloured gear in the second photo? I think I see just the edge of it peeking out.

Barry

Phono48 wrote:Isn't that the winding pawl underneath the large copper coloured gear in the second photo? I think I see just the edge of it peeking out.

Barry

I agree. Could it be missing a spring?

As Barry said, the pawl can be seen under the copper plated winding gear on the spring shaft. If you had the ratchet or pawl off for cleaning, be sure something wasn't reinstalled backwards. I"m sure there are no springs used; it is just the rocking motion of the pawl that causes locking and unlocking. Perhaps the pawl is sticking for some reason. The weird thing is that it works upside down but not right side up. It should work equally well in any position.
BTW: that is the same motor as a late VV-IV.

Jim