The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Since the 'My First 7" Record' was morphing into a 'One That Got Away' thread, I thought I'd start a new thread and post one of the worst things that I ever did.

I was at the Pasadena City College Flea Market back in the mid-1980's. I loved that flea market because since there was no admission, you could get there in what I call 'Flashlight Weather' -- in other words, before the sun was even up -- and that was my habit.

All that summer I had the most remarkable luck finding disc music boxes with bells! I had found a 15.5" Polyphon with bells in an antique shop in Templeton, California for well under market; and an early ornate walnut Regina 15.5" with bells a month later in a consignment shop in the far desert back country of San Diego County, in a little outpost along the Mexican border called Boulevard. That box was only $300! The crank was missing, but no problema.

Then I bought the remains of a mechanical music restorer's estate that had been stored away since his death in the early 1960's and acquired a nice Imperial Symphonion with bells, and a mech only for a 9" Regina with bells. I couldn't believe this streak of luck with disc bell boxes!

I was immediately turning these boxes at nice profit to a wealthy friend who was a music box collector.

So, I'm walking along at the flea market and I come upon the tarp on the ground of a dealer I knew named Bill. On the tarp is the rarest and most desirable of all disc music boxes -- a 27.5" Emerald Polyphon with bells! These are 'casket case' music boxes that are wider than they are deep. The lid runs the width of the box and is in two sections, front and back; each half of the lid is divided again into two sections, and when it is opened, the lid halves fold out once, and then once again. exposing the metal soundboard, combs, tracker bar, and bells. A brass arm with a roller on the end then swings out from the center of each outer lid section to further support the immense 27.5" metal disc. These were the largest table model disc-size music boxes made, 27.5" discs being typically reserved for large upright boxes. They were made with and without bells. They are rare without bells, but with bells . . . OMG!
The problem was, this thing looked like it had been set on fire, put out in a flood, and then horses trampled it. I have never seen anything in such poor condition. Bells missing, heavy rust, many broken teeth, the case just ruined. I mean, it was bad. There were a few special 27.5" bell discs with it, but they were shot, too -- rusty, broken projections, bent, creased.

"How much?", I asked. "$500", said Bill.

Now I can usually make a decision on buying something or not very rapidly, especially in a flea market situation where there are others waiting in line behind and breathing down your neck to see what you do; but in the case of this rust bucket, I honestly was having trouble determining if there was $500 worth left of it. It wasn't the price so much as the condition . . . price vs condition, I guess, but really, the condition. My gears were really grinding in my head. I looked over at my wife for help. She shook her head subtly and that made my decision for me. I thanked Bill and we walked on.

That afternoon, I had to go to my music box buddy's house in Orange County for some reason and told him the story about the Polyphon (this was before cel phones). His eyes popped out of his head, "Do you think it's still there?! I'd give you $1500 in any condition!" We jumped into his big Mercedes and drove, I swear, 100mph all the way from coastal Orange County to Pasadena. Lots of adrenaline pumping! By this time it was 3pm and the flea market was winding down. We walked up to Bill's spot and sure enough it was gone. As I stood there looking at the spot where it was, I felt the strangest sensation that something like liquid was draining out my arms through the tips of my fingers and onto the ground. Of course, there was no liquid, but I honestly think it was my luck draining out -- literally 'running out'. That was the last disc bell box I have found in the wild to this day. I often wonder if I denied the gift of that box, and by doing so, changed my own luck.

Great story, John! I'm sure we have all experienced the find that we passed on and later wish we made the move on. It still happens to me today even tho' I made up my mind long ago that it would not. And it's just as likely that the opposite is true where we made the move on an item and later wish we had not so it would be instead "The One That Should Have Got Away" ! Although I must admit that I've learned a lot since my earlier collecting years so thankfully the mistakes happen a little less than 20 years ago. C'mon everyone let's hear some of your stories!

About a year ago I wrote on another board about my passing up an Amberola 1B, so I won't go into that...

But in 1985 I walked into an antique shop in Somer's Point, New Jersey to find an oak Herzog "724" - that's the full round cylinder cabinet. The original shelves were missing, and someone had replaced them with ½" plywood. But the original finish on the outside was nice. It would have been a reasonably straightforward restoration - - and I knew someone with a "724" whose shelves and peg pattern I could use as a model. But the price was $400. Too steep, I finally decided, especially with a baby due in 60 days. Well, I came to regret THAT move before the baby arrived, and I called the dealer whose card I had thoughtfully kept. Too late. Nowadays, that cabinet would be worth around ten times the price...

Back in 1985, there were no books to tell us about cylinder cabinets!

George P.

This is both a one that got away and a "got" story. One day about 15 years ago I went to visit a friend who was a long time antique dealer. He's now passed on but back in those days he had a small outbuilding that was heated with an old pot belly stove. I loved the smell of that wood burning whenever I visited walked into his barn him in the cold months. Anyway, he told me that one of his regular pickers brought him an Amberola 75 with some cylinders and if I wanted everything he would make my drive worthwhile (he was about 2 hours drive from our home). I already had an Amberola 75 but I figured if the price was right why not? It was in pretty good shape and we made a deal. On the way home I decided to stop into a shop that NEVER had anything of interest in the past. I walked in and the owner came out to greet me. I looked around and saw the same exact items I had seen there for at least the last 5 years! I said, "you don't have any crank phonographs or records in do you...". "Matter of fact I have two in the other room. Wanna see 'em?". I followed him in and before me was a gorgeous mahogany Sonora Baby Bombe. He had $350 on a tag hanging off the crank. The other phono was an Edison LU-37 in mahogany and in perfect shape. Now, I knew the secret of LU-37 machines....do you know the secret? This is a rather late model machine and USUALLY there are rather late Edison Diamond Discs with it if the machine is virgin which this one was. I opened the record storage area and it was full. I began pulling out each record one by one and every one with the exception of only a few were late 52,000 series and most were great dance band tunes. My pulse rate increased. I stood up and reached over to the tag on the crank. "$325". I asked if the price included the records. "Yup...what you see is what you get". I said I'll take it. But, I didn't have room for the Sonora so I left it behind. I was too excited to think about that one anyway and all the way home I couldn't wait to play those late Edisons. A couple weeks later after a little "wife convincing" about the Sonora I called the dealer back. "Do you still have that other phonograph?", I asked. "Nope, sold it yesterday. Sorry. You shoulda taken it that day you were here!". Ohhhhhh boy... So I won some and I lost one!

Doug

About 20 years ago, a co-worker told me, "Gee - I wish I had known last month that you collect those old record players! My brother and I were cleaning out my mother's place and there was one of those Edisons with a big horn and it sat on a beautiful cabinet for the records. It was round, and when you opened one door, the other opened by itself."

This woman certainly had my attention by now. Before I could ask her anything more, she volunteered, "That pretty cabinet was just FULL of those record roll things!"

This is usually the point when my alarm clock goes off, but believe me - I was wide awake already. Hoping that perhaps they had sold the outfit to a generalized dealer or perhaps some relative had reluctantly taken it, I asked the burning question: "What happened to it?"

The woman screwed her face into an exasperated expression and said, "My stupid brother hauled everything out into her back field and burned it."

...And this was in the late 1980s. Stupid indeed.

George P.

phonogfp wrote:About a year ago I wrote on another board about my passing up an Amberola 1B, so I won't go into that...

George P.

George,

Dropping the ball on a Herzog 724 is shameful enough but an Amberola 1B??? That's almost grounds to drum you off this board! If you think most of us here have already heard the story, or are understandably reluctant to re-endure the public humiliation please send me the story by PM.

Cheers, Bruce

Valecnik wrote:If you think most of us here have already heard the story...

Bruce,

If I remember correctly, this was shared in a similar thread (perhaps started by George?) back when we were on ProBoards. Unfortunately, the last I heard, despite their promises of turning over our content to us, they’ve yet to deliver that to John. Thankfully now our content isn’t hostage to the board host.

Perhaps we can get him to tell the story again...regretfully, I don’t remember the details.

And while I don’t have any ‘the one that got away’ stories of my own to share, it’s been interesting reading those shared by others. Thank you all for posting them.

— MordEth

Bruce, I'd be willing to bet that if any of us were in the same situation as described by George in his 'missed' stories we would have likely done the same thing. I know I would have. We all (or most of us) have had these situations where we either missed out on something we regret later or even bought something we probabaly paid too much for or wish we didn't. I enjoy sharing my stories and hearing those shared by others and would hope that we can all enjoy these stories as we're all bound to experience these one time or another.

Doug

FellowCollector wrote:Bruce, I'd be willing to bet that if any of us were in the same situation as described by George in his 'missed' stories we would have likely done the same thing. I know I would have. We all (or most of us) have had these situations where we either missed out on something we regret later or even bought something we probabaly paid too much for or wish we didn't. I enjoy sharing my stories and hearing those shared by others and would hope that we can all enjoy these stories as we're all bound to experience these one time or another.

Doug

Doug, don't get me wrong. My assertion that George should be "drummed off the board" was totally tongue in cheek. I was just thinking of George of all people missing an Amberola 1, a machine he's studied extensively, and also one of my favorite machines.

Believe me, I've missed my share too. I've also paid way too much because I "had to have" something. The only reason I have not yet posted by "one that got away" story is that I'd have so many I wouldn't know where to start.

Cheers,
Bruce

Thanks for defending me, Doug! Bruce certainly didn't mean any offense - - it's just that I recently finished a 3-part article on Amberola 1As and 1Bs; and with the help of several members of this board (including Bruce), have been researching these machines for the past 7 months. So it naturally seems funny that I should have walked away from a bargain relating to one of these. But back in 1973, I was a 19 year old kid who didn't know an Amberola from my elbow. I had been collecting for 6 years, but the only book I'd managed to find was The Fabulous Phonograph by Roland Gellatt. It's a fine book, but contains precious little information about particular phonographs. So I was completely unprepared - - a babe in the woods - - when the following transpired...

I had accompanied my parents to meet some old friends of theirs from Alabama. We all met in the Poconos outside of Stroudsburg, Pennsylvania in January 1973. The old rambling wooden hotel was fun to explore, but within a few hours I was bored out of my skull. The next morning I took dad's big Buick and set out to find any antique shops in the area.

I drove aimlessly for awhile, and soon spotted a sign with the words, "ANTIQUE SHOP" and an arrow. I followed the arrow and drove for several more miles, wondering if perhaps the shop had closed. Then, another sign and an arrow. I hop-scotched my way through rural Pennsylvania in this fashion for perhaps 25-30 miles, until coming to a final sign directing me to turn left onto Cherry Valley Road. I did so, and came to the end of the road without having seen a shop. I turned around and slowly cruised back. There were only a few houses on Cherry Valley Road, and the aged owner of one of them stood in his front yard waving to me. I asked if there was an antique shop on this road, and he gestured me to park in his driveway. Eureka!

The old gentleman, speaking with a thick German accent, asked me if I was looking for anything in particular. I gave the answer you'd expect, and he wordlessly motioned for me to follow him. I was surprised as he led me across the road - away from the house and barn. What was going on here? (Yes - I could hear banjo music...) Then I saw a chicken coop nestled in the sumac bushes. (Banjo music getting louder?) The man led me into the coop, and there in the half-light stood a large upright phonograph of some kind. It was mahogany, and as I lifted the lid I was surprised to see that it was an Edison and played cylinder records. I had a "Standard" and a "Home", but had never encountered such a large beast playing cylinders. I was particularly struck by the maroon paint on the upper mechanism. Very pretty... Opening the lower door revealed 4 drawers. I opened one of them and saw that it was full of Blue Amberols - - except that every 3rd or 4th one was purple in color. I'd never seen that before either. Each drawer was full of records, and there were lots of those funny purple cylinders mixed in each drawer.

I counted 25 records per drawer, so that totaled 100 cylinders. Back then, Blue Amberols were going for $2 per record, so the contents of the drawers was worth $200, I figured. I asked the old gentleman what the price was.

"Vell, vat do you vant to gif for it?"

I considered my meager finances, and offered $150. The man rubbed his chin and began thinking. I suddenly imagined the awful consequences should he accept my offer. I didn't have the cash on me, of course. I'd need to drive back and arrange a loan with dad - not a sure thing by any stretch. Especially considering that we'd have to squeeze the Amberola either in the trunk or the back seat of the car - - and there were going to be 4 of us in the car heading back home. What had I done? Was I crazy?

The man finally said, "I tink I need a leetle more."

With an inward sigh of relief, I thanked the man and drove away - ignorant and happy.

A month later, my copy of George Frow's first paperback Guide to the Edison Cylinder Phonograph arrived in the mail. I learned that my discovery had been an Amberola 1B (possibly a 1A), and I surmised that it was worth well in excess of $150. I immediately wrote a letter to the Pennsylvania gentleman, offering a princely $175 for the machine and records. I would consider any price he might suggest. Months passed and I heard nothing back from him. Being young and inexperienced, I gave up.

Six years later I was driving past Stroudsburg with my young wife, and recounted the story to her. I was struck with a sudden urge... Would she mind if we exited and attempted to track down the old German of hallowed memory? She was agreeable, and within minutes we were winding our way through Stroudsburg. My dim recollection was that Cherry Valley Road had been in the countryside north of the city. We turned this way and that. Barb asked if I had any idea where I was going, to which I cheerfully answered in the negative, but miraculously, we came to an intersection I recognized. A right turn, up the hill, and over the crest was - - Cherry Valley Road. We drove down the road and who should be standing in his front yard - as though he hadn't moved? I pulled over, reintroduced myself and reminded him of the phonograph and my letter.

"Oh yah, yah... You know I solt dot phonograph only last mont for two hundret dollars!"

I'm sure my jaw hit the ground. "But I sent you a letter six years ago offering $175! Why didn't you ever write back?"

The old man smiled, "I didn't tink you ver serious!"


George P.