The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Hi folks.
My name is Chris and I'm the proud new owner of a 1915 VV-XVI.
Of course, I've heard of "Victrola" before but I never would have guessed that I would enjoy owning one so much!
I wasn't planning on it, but when I saw it sitting there covered in dust, over in the corner of a basement at an estate sale, I couldn't resist. I just had to have it. I feel that I probably paid full retail at $290 but I'll be keeping this rather than flipping it like I usually do with my estate sale finds.
There is very minimal delamination secluded to the back bottom corner. No crazing and what little roughness there was, I was able to take care of with orange cleaner and 800 grit wet/dry sandpaper.
It has a nice coat of quality wax and she has a nice shine!
Best of all, my young son and "treasure hunting" partner is really interested in learning about the early days of recorded sound with me.

So now I have several questions.
I'll start with the smallest one first.

1) On the floor of the bottom storage compartment, there are two holes with brass inserts near the front corners.
What are they for? I've looked around this site and elsewhere and the only thing that I can find is mounting holes for a possible missing record storage shelf. Perhaps something like is shown in the pictures in this thread?
http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... =9&t=26786

2) There are two key holes on the front of the cabinet. The top one for the lid has a lock mechanism but the one below that does not. Is that one just eye candy only?

3) Is the speed indication needle removable? I tried to pull it off so that I could remove the motor from the motor board but no luck. I didn't want to break anything so I carefully jiggered the board off around it but I don't want to do that again.

4) Now the big question... motor cleaning.
Like I said, I took the motor off of the board. I degreased it and applied 3-in-1 oil and Vaseline to the points indicated by the the motor diagram on the underside of the motor board.
Overall it runs smooth and quite except for the springs thumping occasionally.
I'm an avid DIYer out of necessity so I plan on doing the spring job myself.
Can anybody please point me to a concise tutorial? Perhaps a video? I've searched YouTube with no luck.
I've read everything that I can find and I do understand the basic premise but I really would feel more comfortable if I could see it being done.

I saw one description suggesting that I can open up the cans without removing the spring and simply soaking them in kerosene and then repacking with grease. Is avoiding removing the spring worth it?

CMcPherson wrote:Hi folks.
My name is Chris and I'm the proud new owner of a 1915 VV-XVI.
Of course, I've heard of "Victrola" before but I never would have guessed that I would enjoy owning one so much!
I wasn't planning on it, but when I saw it sitting there covered in dust, over in the corner of a basement at an estate sale, I couldn't resist. I just had to have it. I feel that I probably paid full retail at $290 but I'll be keeping this rather than flipping it like I usually do with my estate sale finds.
There is very minimal delamination secluded to the back bottom corner. No crazing and what little roughness there was, I was able to take care of with orange cleaner and 800 grit wet/dry sandpaper.
It has a nice coat of quality wax and she has a nice shine!
Best of all, my young son and "treasure hunting" partner is really interested in learning about the early days of recorded sound with me.

So now I have several questions.
I'll start with the smallest one first.

1) On the floor of the bottom storage compartment, there are two holes with brass inserts near the front corners.
What are they for? I've looked around this site and elsewhere and the only thing that I can find is mounting holes for a possible missing record storage shelf. Perhaps something like is shown in the pictures in this thread?
http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... =9&t=26786

2) There are two key holes on the front of the cabinet. The top one for the lid has a lock mechanism but the one below that does not. Is that one just eye candy only?

3) Is the speed indication needle removable? I tried to pull it off so that I could remove the motor from the motor board but no luck. I didn't want to break anything so I carefully jiggered the board off around it but I don't want to do that again.

4) Now the big question... motor cleaning.
Like I said, I took the motor off of the board. I degreased it and applied 3-in-1 oil and Vaseline to the points indicated by the the motor diagram on the underside of the motor board.
Overall it runs smooth and quite except for the springs thumping occasionally.
I'm an avid DIYer out of necessity so I plan on doing the spring job myself.
Can anybody please point me to a concise tutorial? Perhaps a video? I've searched YouTube with no luck.
I've read everything that I can find and I do understand the basic premise but I really would feel more comfortable if I could see it being done.

I saw one description suggesting that I can open up the cans without removing the spring and simply soaking them in kerosene and then repacking with grease. Is avoiding removing the spring worth it?

To properly clean a phonograph motor the spring needs to be removed from the barrel. This gives you the ability to properly clean it and inspect it for breaks or repairs at the end of the spring. Spring replacement is a little tricky the first time and you can easily injure yourself.

Yeah... It did sound like a short cut not worth taking.
From all of the reading that I've done, I do realize that I need to be careful. That's why I'm looking for a video tutorial.

You can find a number of good restorers in the "Links" section here.

Outside of the mainsprings, the motor is fairly straightforward to clean and reassemble. A wonderful fount of information can be found in Eric Reiss's The Compleat Talking Machine.

The other important part is restoring the reproducer or soundbox. There are some people on this forum who have great experience in this field: you cannot go far wrong with them.

Bill

Welcome Chris.

Here's a six part tutorial below on cleaning and disassembly of a two spring motor that someone made (not mine).
This won't be the same motor in your machine so some procedures will be slightly different, but it's a good starting point. You'll figure it out.

If you're nervous about it, you could place the spring barrel in an old pillow case while you attempt to
remove and replace the spring. I was nervous about my first one, but after it was finished I wondered why
I was so concerned about loosing the ability to control my hands.

Just make sure the motor is run down completely before you start to disassemble it. I spin the governor manually several times after the motor stops on it's own to try and get any little extra tension that remains.

The speed indicator should be removable, the procedure may be slightly different depending on the year of your XVI. You have pictures?

The lower key hole should lock the record compartment.

I'm not sure about the holes you describe as I don't have a XVI. They could be the shipping holes that were
used to crate the machine when it was originally shipped to dealers?


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6R9i7zp-v9s[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEkUpM-yykM[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ZdI0ttrKfQ[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=epE-r9Dd7qU[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xy8_NRP7EIo[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=af0n5cYl9TI[/youtube]

I'm surprised you didn't find anything, as there are literally dozens of clips about spring barrel rehaul. Here's another about disassembling:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DN5B9OV8_ss

and here another about reassembling:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqksf_d_mK4

Key rules are: 1) check twice if the motor is completely wound-off before removing the barrel 2) verify that you/your son have indeed strong firm hands 3) do not, for any reason, "let things go": hold the barrel AND the spring with very firm hands, always.

If you're an experienced DIYer it's not a very difficult task: I learned it by myself just looking at videos like these. The edges of the spring are not sharp as some braggarts who never saw a spring sometimes pretend they are: they are actually smooth and safe to touch. It is also absolutely untrue that the spring will "unroll 200 ft long" - another very common sentence by those who pretend to be able to do this job but actually never did it: the spring will stay quite nicely wounded in circle. In any case, I suggest wearing a pair of gloves with a good rubber grip, also because there'll be grease everywhere and it would take forever to have your hands clean again.

Stephen_Madara wrote:

CMcPherson wrote:I took the motor off of the board. I degreased it and applied 3-in-1 oil and Vaseline to the points indicated by the the motor diagram on the underside of the motor board.

Three-in-one oil is not a good choice, as after a while it dries out and goes sticky, causing more problems. Sewing machine or clock oil is ideal.

It looks like you have some good information as stated in previous posts. Were records included with the Victrola? The phonograph was built during the acoustic recording era.

Welcome to the madness, Chris!

You've received some excellent information already, so I won't repeat it.

Being new to the hobby, you might enjoy the introductory articles found on the Antique Phonograph Society web site:

http://www.antiquephono.org/

Just click the "Articles" tab and enjoy!

George P.

Don't use "3 in 1" oil. Not sure exactly what it is, but it ain't oil. Let a drop or two just sit for a while on a piece of glass or anything not porous. Come back a few days later and it will be gone, dried up.

Just a good grade of motor oil is fine. 10W-30 or similar.