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I'm trying to determine an adequate 1.5 voltage battery configuration with size C or D cell batteries (two D cells in parallel or four C cells in parallel) for a replica 1.5 volt No. 6 dry cell vintage battery to power the Edison Electric Automatic Stop feature on my C-250 Edison phonograph. Is one configuration recommended over the other to minimize damage to the electro-mechanical mechanism over time? Does anyone know the typical amperage of the original No. 6 dry cell battery and what battery configuration closely matches it?

Thanks!

AR

I and a friend experimented with his Edison electric stop. We concluded that 1.5 volts was not sufficient to operate reliably, that 1.5 volts could not overcome a very slight resistance even though we had cleaned the contacts. We had to use a 6 volt lantern battery to have a reliable operation. I think Edison was right to go with a mechanical cutoff.

VintageTechnologies,

Thanks for your response. That's interesting because I have mine reliably working with two D cell batteries in series (3 volts total). I thought 6 volts would have been too much voltage. I've seen replica no. 6 batteries with the two configurations I mentioned on the internet but haven't tried the configurations myself...I just assumed both configurations would work. Based on the results of your experiments I'm going to rig two D cell batteries in parallel to see for myself if this configuration does in fact work or not.

AR

VintageTechnologies wrote:I and a friend experimented with his Edison electric stop. We concluded that 1.5 volts was not sufficient to operate reliably, that 1.5 volts could not overcome a very slight resistance even though we had cleaned the contacts. We had to use a 6 volt lantern battery to have a reliable operation. I think Edison was right to go with a mechanical cutoff.

I came to the exact same conclusion through my experimentation with a single "C" cell battery.

I found that 2 "C" batteries in series seemed to work fine, but I don't recall if I tried them in parallel. I'd be curious to know if doubling the amperage at 1.5V would be adequate.

Best,
Fran

fran604g wrote:

VintageTechnologies wrote:I and a friend experimented with his Edison electric stop. We concluded that 1.5 volts was not sufficient to operate reliably, that 1.5 volts could not overcome a very slight resistance even though we had cleaned the contacts. We had to use a 6 volt lantern battery to have a reliable operation. I think Edison was right to go with a mechanical cutoff.

I came to the exact same conclusion through my experimentation with a single "C" cell battery.

I found that 2 "C" batteries in series seemed to work fine, but I don't recall if I tried them in parallel. I'd be curious to know if doubling the amperage at 1.5V would be adequate.

Best,
Fran

Putting the batteries in parallel (1.5v) probably would not work as well as in series (3v). We tried a full-sized 1.5v igniter battery, the same size and amperage as the original No. 6, with poor results. While you do need a certain minimum of amperes (current), you also need enough volts (pressure) to push enough current through some resistance. Watts = volts x amps

VintageTechnologies wrote:

fran604g wrote:

VintageTechnologies wrote:I and a friend experimented with his Edison electric stop. We concluded that 1.5 volts was not sufficient to operate reliably, that 1.5 volts could not overcome a very slight resistance even though we had cleaned the contacts. We had to use a 6 volt lantern battery to have a reliable operation. I think Edison was right to go with a mechanical cutoff.

I came to the exact same conclusion through my experimentation with a single "C" cell battery.

I found that 2 "C" batteries in series seemed to work fine, but I don't recall if I tried them in parallel. I'd be curious to know if doubling the amperage at 1.5V would be adequate.

Best,
Fran

Putting the batteries in parallel (1.5v) probably would not work as well as in series (3v). We tried a full-sized 1.5v igniter battery, the same size and amperage as the original No. 6, with poor results. While you do need a certain minimum of amperes (current), you also need enough volts (pressure) to push enough current through some resistance. Watts = volts x amps

Well here's the rub:

The original configuration was to use a single No. 6 cell, and we have to assume this arrangement worked as it was designed. So does it figure that the original No. 6 cell @ 1.5V had a higher (longer lasting) amperage output than any extant examples? EDIT: Or did the original No. 6 cell actually provide a higher voltage?

Of course it's probably anyone's guess how long the rated output actually performed and lasted.

Also, I noted through reading several articles, that the modern "D" cell has a somewhat higher rated output amperage than "A", "AA", and "C" cells, yet all are rated at 1.5V.

Best,
Fran

VintageTechnologies,

I found a new No. 6 dry cell on http://www.batterygiant.com/batteries/EN6

Is this the same type you tested with poor results?

AR

apruizii wrote:VintageTechnologies,

I found a new No. 6 dry cell on http://www.batterygiant.com/batteries/EN6

Is this the same type you tested with poor results?

AR

Yes, that is the exact type we used with poor results. It is equal to an original. Being radio guys, we checked our connections and cleaned all contacts thoroughly. That battery would work - kind of, sort of, sometimes. You can shoot for authenticity or reliability, but perhaps not both!

A link that illustrates the relative levels of stored energy of common modern batteries:

https://sizes.com/materials/dry_cells.htm

As can be seen, there can be quite a bit of difference among the choices, and the No. 6 battery has a very high mAh rating when compared to the modern smaller batteries.

EDIT: It should be noted that additional circuit resistance can very likely cause failure of the E.A.S., and all of the contact points in the electrical circuit should be properly cleaned and restored to ensure proper conductivity for the electric circuit to be adequately energized. The holes on the motor plate for mounting the solenoid were originally gold plated, and I'm sure this was done to eliminate excessive resistance.

Best,
Fran

At such a low voltage as 1.5 volts, even the increase of resistance by 1 ohm may reduce the flow of current enough to affect the functioning of a circuit (such as an electromagnet), depending on its power requirements to operate.