The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

One of my customers purchased one single Edison Diamond Disc record from me, and I shipped it to them via USPS Media Mail, packed like a brick house. Cost just under $4 to ship, for a box under 3 pounds.

My customer received the record, with the word "MEDIA" on the shipping label crossed out in black marker, and the word "NOT" written next to it. Then USPS put "POSTAGE DUE: $9.59" on the box, which my customer was obliged to pay to the postman.

What happened: USPS is cracking down on eBay sellers (and anybody, really) that takes advantage of USPS by using Priority Mail supplies to send via Media Mail, and people sending non-media items via Media Mail because it is significantly less expensive than Parcel Select or Priority Mail. SO a small percentage of the boxes are opened for inspection to make sure the contents are in fact printed matter, music media, books, etc.

Well, this box was opened. And the Postal inspector found the Diamond Disc record packed inside, and didn't consider it music! All you Victor Talking Machine fans............exercise some self control now! So, they re-calculated the box weight based on Priority Mail postage and billed the difference to my customer.

Me: "THIS IS WAR"

I suggested to my customer that he take the box, record, and my invoice to the Postmaster and DEMAND his $9.59 back. What I didn't tell him was to bring a photo of Thomas A. Edison and a short quiz about some of his more notable inventions. Furthermore...the disc was LET US NOT FORGET. I mean, c'mon.......

In near 20 years of selling records, I have only had a postal inspection TWICE. Once before it was on a stack of 20 Diamond Discs that I had purchased. Delay of 13 days because of the Media Mail postal inspection. What a headache. But it is part of the process.

I'll be fighting this from my end as well. I am on good terms with my Postmaster, and she can get the job done. This is RIDICULOUS.

In future: I will be writing "(1) 78rpm musical recording disc" on the sandwich of cardboard inside each record box I ship. Or, maybe I should author a 5x7 enclosure, with a message to the postal inspector explaining what type of musical recording it is, and justifying that it is, in deed....MEDIA MAIL material.

OK. Enough kvetching.

-Wyatt

Can we then expect regular updates on the 'Media Mail Wars?'

You should indeed be able to fight this and get the "postage due" back. I had a similar experience with a box full of cylinders, which are, after all, sound recordings. The clerks who know me had no issues at all ignoring the incorrect postage due markings.

A short time later, I actually brought an Amberola 30 into the PO and had a small "concert" for the clerks so they could know they did the right thing!

That's a fabulous story. I'll let everyone know what happens.

Player piano rolls can really be fun with the post office. If your postmaster get in touch with the post office on the other end, they should be able to sort it out.

If you turn priority mail boxes inside out or use any of that stuff for packing material, and send it as media mail they do get touchy about that. Even if you are using up old boxes that have already been sent through the mail already.

I've had them lose three records in the last 6 months or so and have asked my postmaster what's going on there. He is uncomfortable with that when I ask him, but really has no answers. I haven't had much trouble with the post office at all and I thought maybe something has changed for them to lose three different boxes lately, but who knows. The thing is, the packages are somewhere in the system, they just can't be bothered to look.

Hi Wyatt. Here is the link to the USPS Media Mail regulations. http://about.usps.com/notices/not121/not121.htm
You are absolutely correct that this person is due a refund. The Postmaster does have the authority to issue that refund. I would print out a copy from the attached link and take it to show him or her. But make certain that the shipping box was not a Priority Mail box or packing inside it was not cut up Priority Mail boxes. Postal regulators state that if Priority Mail boxes are used in any way that Priority Mail rates will apply. Plain unmarked boxes must be when shipping Media Mail.

Here is what I would suggest when a Media Mail package is received with postage due tell the mail carrier that you don't have the money to pay the postage due amount and that you will pick it up at the post office. This way you can go to the post office and speak with the Postmaster or manager to resolve the problem.

Rich Gordon

Wyatt, one of the things I do is to add the words Fragile Phonograph Records under Media Mail.

Sometimes with valuable discs, I have written a note on the cardboard used to protect the disc. It is addressed the the Postal Inspector and lets them know that this Disc Record or Cylinder Records is very fragile, valuable, and needs special handling. Also that it must be re-packed as found.

My regular postal clerk looked at me funny once and asked, is this one of our priority boxes? I replied, "Maybe". The box has wrapped in brown paper and to her the size was the tell. I was lazy and did not have the correct box on hand. She then informed me to never use any free products intended for Priority Mail, including tape. If inspected, your customer will be asked to pay the upcharge for Priority Service. I thanked her for the advice and changed the box.

Once, I used another location as I drove across town and the clerk informed me that Records were not Media Mail. I replied that they are and he need to ask a higher-up. The two other clerks in the lobby corrected him and one added, "Yes vinyl records are media". I decided not to put on my professor hat that day.


FYI, years ago they printed only one side of the Priority boxes and folks would break the glued edge and re-glue them inside out for a free box. This was revealed via inspections and now they have printing on both surfaces.

James.

I know the Priority Mail envelopes and boxes are an issue to the post office, so I gather up UPS and FEDEX boxes and envelopes to reuse... the post office has never complained about that and they can't charge for a service they don't provide...

I use Media Mail a lot, for shipping books I wrote. Very cheap -- but very, very slow.

Although cylinders and discs are obviously "media" even if postal authorities don't understand that, I would never use Media Mail to ship old records, especially not valuable old records. The cheap rate comes at a price -- it is handled less well, and travels very slowly. If a record is worth $30, $40, $100, or whatever I'd much rather just run with Priority. It's well worth the premium. That will reach a buyer in 2-3 days; Media Mail can take anywhere from a week to 10 days or even longer. (Two weeks is not unusual.) Priority Mail is a great service, a bargain compared to Fedex or UPS 2 to 3 day delivery rates.

I can understand why the post office would crack down. The service is definitely abused. I once bought a clock on eBay, it was sent Media and took forever, but it wasn't caught even though the gong chimed every time the box was moved even slightly.

I had to print out the USPS rules for Media Mail and show them to the clerks at my post office because they wouldn't give me the media mail rate. They were also trying to convince me that records don't count as "sound recordings". (I was like what else would a record be?!?)

I've been charged at the door before receiving my record as well! The delivery person came up to my door and wanted an extra $4 all while holding my package hostage. They told me it was because they opened the package and saw the seller used the free "Priority Mail" materials to pad the inside. This included a sliced up Priority box and a Priority bubble mailer. I guess you can't use ANY of the Priority materials unless you use the Priority rate.

Oh and the worst part was, I told the seller about this after we communicated back and forth about why I was charged at the door. He was very helpful until we figured out that it was his fault for using "cut up" Priority materials. Then I never heard back from him.......

-Connor