The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Here is an uncommon very early Orthophonic recording of a pretty rare piece by Mengelberg and the New York Philharmonic-Symphony Orchestra (he shared music directorship of this orchestra at the time with Toscanini). It was issued on 2 10" red bat wing "oval VE" discs, and I don't believe it was ever reissued on scroll pressings.
The transfer is minty-fresh (just this week).

Ernest Schelling: A Victory Ball Fantasy (Vic 1127/1128 (BVE-33554-3/33555-2/33556-4/33556-2; 10/9/25)

Some info on the composer: Schelling, Ernest Henry (1876–1939)

US pianist and composer. After his debut as a child prodigy at Philadelphia at the age of four, he studied at the Paris Conservatory. He later studied in Vienna, with Leschetizky for piano and Bruckner for composition, and elsewhere, with Paderewski, Moszkowski, and others. He toured widely, joined the US army in 1918, and later lectured on the orchestra to children in his New York Philharmonic Orchestra Children's Concerts (1924–39).

And a description of the piece

What fascinating piece of music! A real ride. Thanks for putting it up, and the link with backround information.

Nice, reasonably transparent transfer too. The record must have been relatively unplayed for those loud, dynamic peaks to have not been ground out.

This one really is unusual, isn't it? And your transfer is great. It did make scroll because I have the second disc on scroll label which means it came up from the States. I've never seen it on a Montreal pressing. It's not bad indeed, for an early electrical...although that quote from Berlioz where the orchestra " gives it the gas" is a little over-modulated.It's appropriate for November 11 too. It's supposed to be representative of the spirits of dead WW 1 soldiers, I think.

Jim

Lenoirstreetguy wrote:...that quote from Berlioz where the orchestra " gives it the gas"....

Jim

I'm unclear as to how Berlioz, who died in 1869, could have commented on the work of a composer born in 1876; am I misreading something here? (Unfortunately for me, my computer won't open the amazon page with the description of the piece.)

Henry, I don't think Jim was implying that Berlioz commented on this piece, but perhaps was referring to generalized orchestral climax with respect to orchestration. I haven't read the quote myself...

Adam,

Amazing piece and a beautiful transfer. Thank you so much for sharing it. As Jim says very apropos of the approaching Armistice Day anniversary.

Regards,
John

beaumonde wrote:Henry, I don't think Jim was implying that Berlioz commented on this piece, but perhaps was referring to generalized orchestral climax with respect to orchestration. I haven't read the quote myself...

OK---silly me, I finally understand. It's a *musical* quote, i.e., Schelling has used in his "Fantasy" some little musical something from a piece by Berlioz. Now I have to go back and listen to the Schelling piece again, because I didn't hear Berlioz the first time around. And I'm embarrassed, as I'm a very big fan of Hector B!

Aha! It's the "Dies irae" theme, the Sequence from the Roman Catholic Mass for the Dead (Requiem Mass). The theme is not by Berlioz, it's ancient, dating from at least the 16th century. Berlioz used it in his "Symphonie Fantastique," mvt. 5, "Dream of a Witches' Sabbath." Other composers have used this theme, too, e.g., Rachmaninoff used it in his "Symphonic Variations." Mystery solved!

Henry wrote:

beaumonde wrote:Henry, I don't think Jim was implying that Berlioz commented on this piece, but perhaps was referring to generalized orchestral climax with respect to orchestration. I haven't read the quote myself...

OK---silly me, I finally understand. It's a *musical* quote, i.e., Schelling has used in his "Fantasy" some little musical something from a piece by Berlioz. Now I have to go back and listen to the Schelling piece again, because I didn't hear Berlioz the first time around. And I'm embarrassed, as I'm a very big fan of Hector B!

Aha! It's the "Dies irae" theme, the Sequence from the Roman Catholic Mass for the Dead (Requiem Mass). The theme is not by Berlioz, it's ancient, dating from at least the 16th century. Berlioz used it in his "Symphonie Fantastique," mvt. 5, "Dream of a Witches' Sabbath." Other composers have used this theme, too, e.g., Rachmaninoff used it in his "Symphonic Variations." Mystery solved!

I'm not positive that's what Jim meant (hopefully he will chime in), but you are right about the Dies Irae theme. Lizst also used it in his Totentanz, I think.

Yes yes that's what I meant. I haven't checked in here for a couple of days. I mentioned Berlioz because the way the theme was used here...the brass particularly was very Berliozian...to coin a term...Of course Rachmaninoff used it in full orchestral array too ( a decade or so later ) so there we are.

Jim