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I was just given an Edison Standard Model A cylinder machine. I stumbled on this board in the process of finding out what I have. It's going to need a lot of work as it has several problems and missing parts. Here's what I have figured out so far.

It looks like an early model A, serial number S47112.

The reproducer look like the model B with a tail as shown on page 80 of The Complete Talking Machine, and is missing the stylus bar and linkage. The copper diaphragm looks to be good but the rubber gaskets are dried up. My reproducer is held in by 2 half moon shaped tabs and I have a thumbscrew that rotates the reproducer.

The main spring is broken where it attaches to the center shaft, and the motor drive gear has a broken tooth and a bent tooth next to it. Also the first gear that the motor drives is missing a tooth. I'm guessing that when the spring broke, the recoil caused the gear damage.

The motor chassis is mounted to the bedplate with 3 screws. The hole in the motor chassis is much larger than the diameter of the screw. I have a lot of slop and think I'm missing some kind of rubber grommet or isolation mount. I've seen the springs in some of the parts blow-ups for the Model B Standards, But I don't think I have enough length on the screw to accommodate 2 springs. I would welcome close up picture of the proper setup.

I also got a pretty nice morning glory horn with painted flowers in the inside. The paint looks original but looks very thin, and I have a few places the you can see through to the metal. It's also very dirty and I'm not sure what to use to clean it. I don't want to do something stupid that will harm the finish.

I could also use some sources for the parts I need and agood source for a replcement decal for the front of the cabinet.

Thanks in advance,

Dick Stachowiak
East Syracuse, NY

First of all, welcome to the Board and to a great Hobby!

Secondly, sounds like you have a machine worthy of your time and effort. I can suggest one source for parts right off the bat: George Vollema in Michigan. He calls himself the "Victrola Doctor," but he knows Edison stuff too, and he's got parts.

http://www.victroladoctor.com/

Dick---- check your personal messages at top left of this home page. your friend michael

Here is another source for Edison parts.
http://www.wyattsmusical.com/

Hi Dick,

Congratulations on your first Edison machine. May you have many more. You picked a popular Edison Standard an ideal machine to help you learn more.

Most members have one or two favorite dealers for the supply of parts and information. You can get dealer contact details on this board. From the Board index page, Click Technical, Links, then Repairs, Parts, & Dealers.

In response to your question about parts, my two favorites:

Edison parts: Ron Sitko in NY, perhaps the closest to you. Previously Ron sold only to dealers, now he's very helpful to individual collectors too.

For Edison and other transfers: Gregg Cline; his are truly the best. Note: There are two types of banners for the Edison Standard. If yours is an early Standard A, then it should have the "Edison Standard Phonograph" banner, otherwise it's simple Edison logo transfer used on most later Standards. Gregg can advise, he'll give you some instructions that help blend the transfer nicely.

Reproducer:
I don't have Reiss' book in front of me, but where you describe the reproducer, I think you have what is called "The Automatic Reproducer" as it has the tail and thumbscrew. The model B is slightly different. Your reproducer will have to be rebuilt, the rubber will have hardened/cracked. Contrary to what many believe, the copper diaphragm can deteriorate, look for pin hole or other evidence. Because you need a new stylus and linkage, you might want to explore having your dealer do this rebuild.

Mainspring:
If you want to jump right into it, this is no easy task. I don't want to get into a debate on this topic, but I would not attempt removing this spring without the help of a burlap bag, not to simply yank the spring and let it fly, but to carefully hold and contain it in the even it jumps out at you. These springs can be dangerous, they are more powerful than the example shown on some web videos.

Broken teeth:
Depends on how bad, two sequential is probably a real problem. But a single you 'might get by' with a single broken tooth on that first gear. Also explore simply filing the bent tooth. You might have to replace the whole assembly.

Chassis, motor springs:
Each of the three motor chassis holes should be larger than the diameter of the screws. Because yours are loose, I'd guess that someone replaced the original with smaller springs. The motor is isolated from the chassis, using heavy duty springs (not rubber grommets)that seat into these larger diameter holes. Then the screw adjusts the distance; it should be firmly snug, no play.

Morning Glory horn:
You note "The paint... looks very thin.. you can see through the metal". This is essentially a shellac coat. Shellac on metal flakes and scratches easily and doesn't protect from rusting. I've not found an acceptable solution to tone down these scratches or even worse, rust. But I'd first suggest you gently clean the morning glory horn. Stay away from anything with alcohol which melts shellac. Try using the most gentle cleaner (soap and warm water) and gentle cloth, the shellac will flake if you scrub. My favorite wood cleaner (Furniture Masque) also will clean these horns, but test in a small are because if the shellac is so deteriorated, almost any cleaner could make it worse. You might just be content with the scratches etc on the horn, evidence of a long life, like some of us.

I have some morning glory horns with beautiful hand painted chrysanthemums, but the horns look pretty bad. Maybe a member on this board has an idea to gently improve the appearance without damaging these horns. Personally, I think more damage has been done to many of these machines when not properly/gently restored rather than a gently cleaning and left alone. Of course, some are in such bad shape, a complete refinishing is the only option.

Again Dick, congrats and good luck. Let us know how you do. Take photos!

Jack Whelan
PhonoJack

Jack
Good sound advice all around.
Kevan

Dick,

Jacks advice about the spring removal is excellent. If the spring is broken and you loose control, you get get cut up pretty badly. Stitches type cut up! Please be careful.

Jack,

I'm restoring a Standard 'A' of a higher serial number than Dick's and have the springless type of chassis mounting consisting of a bolt with a washer between the chassis and bed plate held in place by a flanged nut which fits into the large hole in the chassis.

Because of a factory defect I discovered in my chassis casting I took some photos of the mounting system yesterday and hope to start a thread on factory defects tonight. You'll be able to clearly see this mounting system.

Bob

PhonoJack wrote:Hi Dick,

Chassis, motor springs:
Each of the three motor chassis holes should be larger than the diameter of the screws. Because yours are loose, I'd guess that someone replaced the original with smaller springs. The motor is isolated from the chassis, using heavy duty springs (not rubber grommets)that seat into these larger diameter holes. Then the screw adjusts the distance; it should be firmly snug, no play.

Jack Whelan
PhonoJack

Jack,

Thanks for the help. My machine came to me without any springs for the motor chassis mounting hardware. Did the springs actually provide isolation and suspension between the motor chassis and the bedplate? It looks to me like the tight springs and bolt would provide little isolation. Was this primarily a way to center the crank in the hole on the side of the cabinet? Should I have a spring on each side of the motor chassis? My original looking hardware is too short to accommodate two springs, and the nut has a cone shaped section that will not fit into the small end of the springs that I picked up on ebay. That's why I thought that I was missing some kind of rubber isolation grommet. Do you know of a site that might have a detail of how the mounting should be?

Thanks,

Dick Stachowiak
East Syracuse, NY

bob27556 wrote:Dick,

Jack's advice about the spring removal is excellent. If the spring is broken and you loose control, you get get cut up pretty badly. Stitches type cut up! Please be careful.

This is good advise if the spring is already broken, but not if you want to reuse the spring. A good spring can be damaged removing it this way.

gramophoneshane wrote:This is good advise if the spring is already broken, but not if you want to reuse the spring. A good spring can be damaged removing it this way.

I'm not understanding how this is bad advice. The bag (whichever you chose to use) is to merely contain the spring should it get away from you. I have been doing this method for over 30 yrs with clock springs (the ones in barrels) as well as phono springs. Believe me, if a spring starts to get away from you, you will not always be able to contain it.