The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Most of you folks probably know that I am a collector of record changers. For those of you who are looking for something a little different from the run-of-the-mill Victor V, check out this Dutch website called ElectricGramophone. Here's a page with the owner's typically excellent visual treatment of an unusual euro record changer, the Joboton model 10:

http://electricgramophone.nl/Jobo_Page/1112815.htm

Note the detailed treatment and multiple views of the machine and its parts. But note expecially the video of it in operation. Most of this guy's videos are also available on YouTube. All the Joboton models seem to use the same basic ratchet and pawl design. The rod extending from under the platter has a pawl that oscillates back and forth and ratchets the cam in small increments. Seems strange and jerky, but it must have been cheaper than a drive shaft with worm gears, I guess. Pretty strange and interesting machines. The little Amusettes are especially weird.

Click on the buttons at the top of the page to go to the "Main Collection" to see many more models. Clicking on the "Detailed Collection" shows the details of the disassembly and restoration of these models as well as videos of most of the detailed models. This is a beautifully done website, and it details many really unusual models of euro record players that are mostly unheard of in the USA. I like it. And it means that there is at least one other record changer collector out there

That is a cool machine Greg. The simplicity is what I find most intriguing along with providing the buyer the value of a changer while allowing them to bring their own electronics.

Thanks for pointing this out.

I find it surprising that a 1950 record changer still used steel needles.

As I have pursued collecting record changers, I have discovered that most of europe was a little behind the USA in electric phono development up until the early 1950s. Most euro models continued to use large magnetic pickups until the late 1940s while the US makers had largely gone to crystal pickups by the mid to late 30s. This lack of development probably has a lot to do with most of europe being bombed to oblivion during WWII and the time necessary to recover their manufacturing capacity. Although this Joboton 10 appears to be using a piezoelectric (PZT) pickup similar to the earliest Astatic crystal models, most of the early euro PZT cartridges used materials more like the later "ceramic" cartridges rather than the Rochelle salts crystals used in the USA. The crystal cartridges are notoriously unreliable whereas the ceramic types are much more robust. Consequently, when you find an early euro player with a PZT pickup, it often still works.

Regardless of the material used, most of the early PZT cartridges were equipped with needle chucks and thumbscrews and were intended to be used with either steel needles or jewel tipped needles. You will see these cartridges in most US changers right up until the microgroove records were introduced in 1948.

Wow. Thanks for the link to that site, Greg. Lots of neat changers there.

There's a fun video of the Thorens Symphony CD50 changer on Youtube. It's a drop-type changer that plays both sides of a record---the cartridge headshell rotates to play the underside of a disc. Neat to watch in action.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgsloOKK-EY

(hope the link works)

SignatureSeriesOwner wrote:I find it surprising that a 1950 record changer still used steel needles.

I've got a 1952 radiogram that only plays 78s & uses a steel needle with magnetic pick-up.
We were way behind the US, and I dont think 33/45s were even being manufactured or sold here until 52 or 53.

Hi Kirk, yeah, that Thorens CD50 is high on my wish list. I am aware of only one or two in europe, and the one that I know about in the USA was bought off a Belgian seller on eBay. They weren't sold in the USA, so far as I know. If anybody has a line on one, please let me know.

Regarding bizarre changers, take a look at the Paillard R5 on the ElectricGramophone site and watch the video. I recently acquired one of these, and it's one of the most peculiar changers I have. I challenge you guys to figure out how it works. At first blush, it looks like a conventional twin-slicer changer that uses knives to slice the bottom record off the stack and drop it to the platter. But look closely at the R5 and you'll see that the rotating shelves are just that - shelves. There are no knives that slice off the bottom record. So how does it singulate the bottom record before the shelves drop it to the platter? It's not obvious:

http://www.electricgramophone.nl/resto/1356134.htm

A lot of the fun with record changers is figuring out how the unusual ones work. Although not shown in the video, this R5 is also a full 10-12 inch intermix (it will play 12 and 12 inch records intermixed in the stack in any order) and it has auto-shutoff at the end of the last record as you see in the video. How does it sense the records in order to accomplish these features? Anybody want to take some guesses?

Is the spindle off-set under the cap providing ledge for a portion of the hole to sit on? The bottom record is centered over the spindle and setting on the shelves. When the shelves move out of the way the bottom record drops, the remaining ones sit on the this small ledge, the cap on the top holds the records horizontal. When the shelves move back into position, it pushes the bottom record "off the ledge" while holding them on the shelve. There are switches on the back shelf that detects if there are any records left, and what size the next to play is.

Did I get?

Good man, Brad! And an eagle eye. A tip of the hat from one gearhead geek to another. It took me several viewings of the video before I figgered it out. Even after I got mine and I got it running, it still fakes me out how it works, even though I know what's going on. You didn't speculate exactly on how the spindles shift in order to singulate the record, but a careful viewing of the still pictures and of the video will show what's going on. The chrome knobs at the top of the spindle towers are both eccentric. As the towers rotate during the cycle, the chrome knobs crank the gantry in an arc. The upper spindle section fastened to the gantry is thus made to move into and out of alignment with the lower spindle. The spindles are aligned when the cycle is complete, allowing the bottom record to locate over the lower spindle while being supported by the shelves. As the cycle runs, the spindles shift which shifts the rest of the stack over the edge of the lower spindle which then supports the upper part of the stack. Eventually the shelves rotate far enough to drop the bottom record down the lower spindle, but by this time the rest of the stack is sitting on the top edge of the offset lower spindle. It's uncanny to see the record stack seemingly suspended in mid-air when the shelves swing out of the way. Particularly since this changer appears to be a twin-slicer but doesn't act like one. Anyway, this is a fun machine with lots of gears, cranks, levers, springs, a driveshaft with TWO universal joints, and a sprag clutch. A Rube Goldberg delight and just fulla wondrous stuff to watch. And it's built like a battleship, so it'll still be working LONG after yer CD players and iPods are pools of melted plastic in the local dump.