The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

I made an incredible phonograph buy today, consisting of five machines and 5 horns. This was the only not-so-great machine of the bunch. I know very little about later Columbia disc machines, so any help would be appreciated. I assume that this one has been monkeyed with.

The motor has an odd start/stop device consisting of a small knob and dial on the side. Turning the dial adjusts the speed, and pulling the knob in and out starts and stops the machine. I've never seen this on a machine before, but maybe it's correct and I'm just ignorant about it. I am assuming that the motor has been changed. There are also extra screws, part of which I assume is a tonearm repair.

I will say that the machine plays very well and sounds great.

Can any one tell me what model this started life as, or if indeed the motor is correct?

Thanks - Mike

This machine looks very much like an "Eclipse", or perhaps a "25": one of the entry-level "Hornless Graphophones" first introduced in 1912. The illustrations in Baumbach & Lackey, however, show these with a top- mounted brake and speed control of a different design.

This looks like an earlier Columbia brake/speed control. My BI, BZH and my Europa have the same style - but only on the Europa is it at the side, as on yours. The motor board does look a little odd, compared to the rest of the case, along with the extra screws: it could be possible (unless someone presents evidence to the contrary) that the motor and board have been replaced.

The fact that there is no extra crank hole might suggest that it was not remotored; on the other hand, someone may have lucked out with a compatible motor.

As we have no good solid documentation of Columbia's manufacturing data, this instrument may remain a mystery...

-Bill

Plunger brake. A vestige of external-horn days.

All of the machines in this lot were skillfully restored. My guess is that whoever restored this one laid a new sheet of veneer over the top, drilled holes, and installed an older type of motor. There were three Edison Homes in the lot too, all of which were restored to perfection.

I'm certainly not a Columbia expert, but that machine looks totally correct to me. The turntable with the beveled edge also looks like all other Columbias I've seen. Maybe Harvey will chime in here, he knows Columbia stuff better than most, I think.

Sean

I agree, there were several Columbia client machines in the 1910-1915 time frame that used that plunger start/stop brake. Maybe Columbia used it for some of their more affordable machines as well? I would also like to hear Harvey's opinion on that topic.

Andreas

alang wrote:I agree, there were several Columbia client machines in the 1910-1915 time frame that used that plunger start/stop brake. Maybe Columbia used it for some of their more affordable machines as well? I would also like to hear Harvey's opinion on that topic.

Andreas

Columbia used many short cuts on their less expensive machines, and it would not surprise me if they wanted to use up a stock of old parts.

That is definitely a Columbia crank

Yes, This Grafonola is absolutely correct. The motor is not a swap. This motor was used on Columbia entry Grafonola and horned machines. This is a small pillar and plate motor imported from Germany from about 1912-1915 or so. Columbia stopped importing these motors and fluted horns, too because of Germany's involvement in WWI. Columbia used what ever stock was left. These motors were used in the Model 15, outside horn Royal, Europa both inside/outside horns, Marvel, and inside horn Consola, and some client machines. These motors were under powered and could barely play through a 10" record. Most of these entry level machines were traded in, junked, or turned into the WWI/WWII scrap drives. Few have survived. Your machine is in fantastic shape. Display it proudly, and enjoy it.
Harvey Kravitz