The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Hello all , recently bought a cylinder phonograph of the type where the mechanism is wholly mounted upon a wooden board which inverts to become the lid of the machine when closed away -- some collectors refer to these as " reversible lid " type , a general design that was used by several European manufacturers , predominantly Pathé. On the left hand motor plate is a logo of crossed swords or rapiers , similar in fact to the marks found on Meissen porcelain. Together with the word " depose " which naturally infers a French or possibly Swiss origin.
The machine was actually sold new by Edison - Bell in UK as their " Domestic A " model , but Edison - Bell " Domestic A " machines are sometimes found which are clearly of Pathé origin , although this machine is not from Pathé. I have actually had have another example from the same stable in the past , but I'm sure that one did not have the crossed swords logo. The mechanism has one or two features which lead me to think its from George Dutrieh of Paris , as identical machines can be found with their " Musica G.D " logo transfer on the front of the case . So my question is please >> does anyone know who used the crossed swords trade-mark ? Was it indeed George Dutrieh, or did that company like Edison - Bell , buy in from other manufacturers such as Paillard for example ? I seem to recall reading somewhere that Paillard used a crossed swords trade-mark at some time , but I may be getting mixed up with something else ! Any help from any of our continental friends much appreciated Dulcetto

It is a phonograph built by the French manufacture L’Epée established in Sainte Suzanne (Doubs).
See the last image on this page of my site Phonorama (click on the red dot):

https://www.phonorama.fr/la-vulgarisati ... raphe.html
Julien Anton

Many thanks for that; I knew of L'Epee as musical box manufacturers, many of them marketed through Thibouville-Lamy, but I had no idea they diversified into phonographs!

Babillard wrote:It is a phonograph built by the French manufacture L’Epée established in Sainte Suzanne (Doubs).
See the last image on this page of my site Phonorama (click on the red dot):

https://www.phonorama.fr/la-vulgarisati ... raphe.html
Julien Anton

Hello Julien , many thanks indeed for identifying the trade- mark , your sharing of knowledge much appreciated ! Like Oedipus , I too was unaware that L'Epee had moved into phonograph manufacture . How interesting ! Also , it expands our knowledge as to where Edison - Bell were obtaining some of the machines they sold. It seems that they were importing from many sources as it is definitely known that they sold Pathé machines , also from Paillard and some German manufacturers , APG from Krefeld for instance. As many of their imported machines survive in relatively few numbers and are consequently infrequently found today , I have a theory that Edison Bell probably bought in remainder - stocks or " last year's model " from these continental suppliers , almost certainly at competitive prices to allow them a good profit margin. Many of Edison - Bell's phonograph models from imported sources are fairly scarce -- their " Crown " , " Ideal " , " Unique " , " Imperial " , models being some examples which readily come to mind.
Thanks again ! Dulcetto