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Group,

I have installed the crane and horn (Cygnet 10) onto my Home Combination Model D. The joining of the two horn pieces was difficult and although I was tempted to use a hammer, I just used my hands and some oil on the two surfaces to help latch the horn. Is this usual to have a very tight fit ?

Also, the picture shows the top adjusting rod at its maximum. Is the spring wrong or do they just sag with time ?

Marc

It may help to show how the horn fits to the reproducer.

James.

The photos show parts from both styles of suspending a Cygnet horn. You have a marriage of Edison parts that is incorrect. Your Cygnet bell has a ball & socket where a spring attaches. This is typical of the majority of Cygnet horns. But you have a spring attached to the lower portion of a rigid Cygnet suspension. That rigid suspension piece along with the adjustable rod should be part of the Cygnet bell. This is typical with the first type of Cygnet horn. You need to decide which technology to embrace, the early or later Cygnet suspension.

If another Forum member recognizes what I am trying to explain, please have a go at it! I will not be offended. It's late and I'm tired and my fingers are babbling at my keyboard.

Jerry B.

This thread has prompted me to show you the suspension of the 11 panel Cygnet horn on my Triumph Model A, in the hope that someone may be able to tell me exactly what I have. The picture was the right way up when I uploaded it!

The horn is a reproduction made in New Zealand by the late Ken Jane who took his manufacturing secrets to the grave. The very helpful Vintage Phonograph Society of New Zealand told me that all his Cygnet horns were of the 11 panel type, because in New Zealand they are found on all models from the Fireside up.

Unfortunately the only size of reproduction crane supplied was modelled on a Standard, so despite the fact that a previous owner has added a second mounting to my horn it still does not hang vertically during play.

Am I correct in assuming that only the top half of the crane varies from model to model? If so, I need a top half for my Triumph. Can anyone please post pictures and measurements to enable me to have one made?

Is there a Forum member that could post a photo from the side of a machine with a rigid Cygnet suspension. I believe a crane for a rigid suspension Cygnet is different than one for a spring suspended Cygnet. Is it just the top half of the crane that's different or both halves? Does anyone reproduce a crane for rigid suspension?

Thanks, Jerry B.

Unfortunately the only size of reproduction crane supplied was modelled on a Standard, so despite the fact that a previous owner has added a second mounting to my horn it still does not hang vertically during play.

Apparently, the reason that a second mount was added to your horn, was to prevent it (the back of the lower portion of the horn) from banging into the crane since you have a horizontal carriage. There are two different cygnet cranes - one for a horizontal carriage (deeper bend) and one for angled carriages (shallow bend) to compensate for the horn being attached either forward or straight up on the reproducer.

Here is the early rigid hanger:
As you can see the top part of the crane is completely different from the later more common spring suspension.

Chuck

Thanks Chuck for the photo. The top half of the crane is different than one with the spring suspension.

Jerry B.

There were two types of Cygnet horn suspensions used on Edison Phonographs. The earlier was the rigid (or bolt) suspension and this was followed soon after by the familiar and more often seen spring suspension. With the rigid suspension, the horn can not move up and down. With the spring suspension, the horn can move up and down as necessary. With the rigid type, a rubber horn connector can not be properly used as the horn will prevent the reproducer from moving up and down to start and stop the playing of the record. With the rigid setup, a special connector is used that slips over the reproducer tube and also slides easily into the lower part of the horn neck. This way, the reproducer can freely be moved vertically. I have attached photos of an Edison Fireside with the earlier rigid suspension. I have shown the connector on the Phonograph with the reproducer in both the raised and lowered (playing) positions. On page 15 of the Oct. 1909 issue of the Edison Phonograph Monthly, a line drawing clearly shows the necessary horn connector. The connector must freely slide into the horn neck and any accidental nicking or bending of the horn neck (or the connector) will cause the connector to bind and not work. This is probably why the changeover to the spring suspension was made.
Dan Z.

Lots of good info,

The top piece with the adjusting nut has a factory hole for a spring. The Cygnet No. 10 horn has a hole on the piece that fits into the horn, so.. I guess that the correct method uses a spring between the two pieces.

Marc