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I bought a very nice and late Victor IV project machine serial #46,5xx. I thought it would be an easy project as it only needed a tonearm and reproducer. But it has not been easy. I fitted a tonearm to the bracket and the needle came down well past the spindle.

Do I have the wrong back bracket? Is it for a late Victor V?

Earlier Victor machines all used the same tonearm. The Victors III and IV had smaller cabinets so the back bracket had a greater depth. The Victor V had a larger cabinet so the back bracket came up quicker.

I would love to talk to someone with an equally late Victor IV or V. I either need a different back bracket or shorter tone arm.

Thanks for any help!
Jerry B.

According to the Victor parts list, Victor IVs in this sequence of serial numbers (46564-47781) shared the tone arm with the III and V, and the bracket with the III. The bracket should be 9 ½" high and 7 9/32" deep. The tone arm alone should be 9" long, or 10 57/64" with extended crook. The parts list shows that this should have the slip-in elbow.

The bracket I have is a little short of 6" deep which would suggest it's for a Victor V. Anyone want to trade a Victor V bracket for a Victor III or IV one???

Jerry B.

The short bracket I believe is for a Victor II, as I pointed out in the photo.
Any bracket from a Victor III through VI will work on the Victor IV.
The tone arm from the III to VI will work, but number VI will be incorrect as it's gold plated, and I don't believe that no Victor IV's had gold plating.
All the brackets from Victor III to VI will work on your VI.
The bracket in your photo with the slip in elbow may also be from a Victor III and should work on the IV with your silver tonearm, but I don't believe it will be correct, even though it may work.

Thanks for the replies to my question. Now I have a few more questions.

I was always taught that the needle should touch the spindle when in a playing position on a Victor. The top photo shows the Victor IV with tone arm and Exhibition. The second photo shows that the needle is past the spindle a short distance. The third and fourth photos show an earlier Victor IV and Victor V with needles that exactly hit the spindle.

Victors III, IV, V, and VI all use the same tone arm. Yes, the VI is gold but it's the same size. I measured my Victor V cabinet at about 16" and another Victor IV at nearly 14". If Victor's goal was to be near the spindle and the tone arms are identical the adjustment was in the back bracket. A Victor III or IV bracket was different than a V or VI. The V and VI bracket came up quicker while the III and IV were deeper.

The photo of my machine shows it with the back bracket that came with it. The needle is a little past the spindle but not by too much. If Victor used the same back bracket for both machines the needle will fall short of the spindle on a V and past the spindle on a IV. Maybe this is true. Does anyone have a similar Victor III, IV, or V that could provide photos? Does the Victor parts list show the same back bracket for the late Victors IV and V?

Once again, thanks for any help.
Jerry B.

Hi Jerry,

I once had a late Vic. IV, and the needle hit the spindle. (Sorry but I don't have the dimensions of the back bracket).
Here are some pictures:

Bob S.

Here are some photos that you can refer to make some comparisons.
That fact that you can use a tone arm and back bracket from a Victor III through V on a Victor II, shows it's not so much the cabinet size that matters, but more of the depth of the tone-arm and back bracket.
Granted, changing the dimensions on the cabinets certainly would make a difference, but it appears Victor kept them very close, or at least with in a ½ inch or so either way from where they back bracket mounts on the back of the cabinet to the centre spindle of the motor.
They only had to be as big as the smallest or largest platter, so the relative dimensions of each cabinet was determined as such.

One could take a 12 inch platter and in theory mount it on a Victor II and it will work, but the platter would hang out well over the edge of the cabinet.
You would have to change the back bracket and tone arm from a Vic III through V, or even a VI, if you wanted gold.

So with your needle just sitting past ¼ to ½ inch, I don't believe it matters that much.

I believe it's slight variations in the cabinets that move the needle a bit for or aft of the record spindle.
This makes more sense to me as I could see this happening when milling the cabinet pieces for assembly.
The castings would remain generally consistent in size, but that depends upon how it was done, if Victor had a master template, that would cast 6 or more at a time when using sand casting, they should be all the same all the time.
This would change if they started making copies of a copy, they would get progressively smaller each time, but anyone casting knows this and is taken into consideration.

I'm sure I'll be clunked on the head for suggesting all this, but the photos say it all.

Does the Victor parts list show the same back bracket for the late Victors IV and V?

No. The V and VI use the same bracket, but the III and IV use a deeper bracket.

Silvertone wrote: Sat Nov 05, 2022 3:50 pm

Does the Victor parts list show the same back bracket for the late Victors IV and V?

No. The V and VI use the same bracket, but the III and IV use a deeper bracket.

So that would mean that the V and VI would have bigger cabinets, probably 12 inches when all the molding and corner pillars were removed.
The III and the IV would have 10 inch cabinets, and the Victor II as well, I just measured it, as well as the IV, the glue on my pillars has let lose, so I can take some accurate measurements.

Both my II and IV measured at exactly 10 inches, so there has to be small variations in the castings.