The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

The term, Berliner, is used extensively here.

But being from Canada, where Victor did not take over the Canadian Berliner business until about 1924, I have a considerable number of records that bear Berliner markings, most often in conjunction with Victor markings. These are sometimes one-sided, but most often two sided. They are sometimes brown rather than black. Generally, they are in most respects conventional laterally cut shellac records. Some of the earlier ones are marginally thicker than "normal" disks (if there is such a thing as normal).

However, while these records are definitely Berliners by self identification of manufacture, I suspect that they do not fall within the scope of definition of the word, Berliner, as it is generally used here.

When you use the word, Berliner, what do you mean by it?

Good topic. When I am speaking of "Berliners" to other collectors, I am referring to the 7" (I have never seen a 5") U.S. made Berliners. I believe these were produced until sometime in 1900. I'm a collector in the U.S.A. and am primarily concerned with those of U.S manufacture.

Generally, when the word "Berliner" is used among collectors, it pertains to the U.S. - made products. When speaking/writing of Canadian Berliners, experienced collectors typically use the term, "Canadian Berliners."

George P.

1. A person from Berlin.
2. A jelly doughnut
3. JFK

Berliner: noun:

A small disc talking machine meant to efficiently convert the maximum amount of money into the minimum amount of audio quality. Just the thing for Christmas presents in 1897.

[quote=phonogfp post_id=329315 time=1682531676 user_id=72]
Generally, when the word "Berliner" is used among collectors, it pertains to the U.S. - made products. When speaking/writing of Canadian Berliners, experienced collectors typically use the term, "Canadian Berliners."

George P.
[/quote]

All 3", 4.92", 5", 7" and 10" records without a paper label with the trademark "E. Berliner's Grammophon" or "E. Berliner's Gramophone" are referred to in Europe as "Berliner", regardless of the manufacturing location.

phonogfp wrote: Wed Apr 26, 2023 1:54 pm Generally, when the word "Berliner" is used among collectors, it pertains to the U.S. - made products. When speaking/writing of Canadian Berliners, experienced collectors typically use the term, "Canadian Berliners."

George P.

Are Hanover-pressed records of the period 1898–1901, without labels and with the words E. BERLINER'S GRAMOPHONE prominently etched or embossed in the central area, not considered to qualify as
Berliners?

Oliver Mundy.

Starkton wrote: Sat Apr 29, 2023 4:15 pm All 3", 4.92", 5", 7" and 10" records without a paper label with the trademark "E. Berliner's Grammophon" or "E. Berliner's Gramophone" are referred to in Europe as "Berliner", regardless of the manufacturing location.

Menophanes wrote: Sat Apr 29, 2023 4:21 pm Are Hanover-pressed records of the period 1898–1901, without labels and with the words E. BERLINER'S GRAMOPHONE prominently etched or embossed in the central area, not considered to qualify as
Berliners?

I should have qualified my response as being the vernacular typically used by U.S. collectors. It would stand to reason that collectors in different parts of the world would use slightly different terminology.

Here in the U.S., the 3", 4.92", 5", and 7" discs marked "E. Berliner's Grammophon" are usually called "Kammer & Reinhardt" discs, while the 10" variety would typically be called a "Gramophone Company" record. Ultimately, they are all Berliners, of course.

George P.

gramophone-georg wrote: Wed Apr 26, 2023 2:51 pm 1. A person from Berlin.
2. A jelly doughnut
3. JFK

Sehr gut, mein Herr!

gramophone-georg wrote: Wed Apr 26, 2023 2:51 pm 1. A person from Berlin.
2. A jelly doughnut
3. JFK

Actually, it's a linesman from Berlin not just any person. Duh