The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Good afternoon from Beijing…

I am looking to purchase an Antique Phonograph, (wind up type), and was hoping to find one for sale here. I would like one that plays 78 RPM disc records, not cylindrical records.

I have a 3-speed record player already but it is defective.

I do not really worry about the players condition as long as the motor and mechanics are working properly.

My budget is ¥2000, but slightly more is okay.

If you have one you want to sell please message or post pictures and information below. Thank you.

Wow. 278.00 to spend. Bet you get a good one

I would suggest an online search with Ebay, Etsy, or Facebook Marketplace for a "portable" or "suitcase" style phonograph. I find that some of the 1930's era models can be purchased for a bargain price and be a great "first" wind up phonograph for a new collector. They are also relatively easy to ship! From there, you can dive into some of the other common/economically priced, but earlier, table models, VV-IVs, etc., etc.

Good luck on your quest!

VV-IV can be had. There are plenty other low budget machines out there as well

edisonclassm wrote: Wed Jun 18, 2025 11:21 am VV-IV can be had. There are plenty other low budget machines out there as well

Or maybe something like a Victrola 50 comes to mind. Shipping, if you are outside the US can be expensive though.

If you live in Beijing, you might also want to try the Panjiayuan Antique Market from time to time. I spotted a few online references to the fact that it specializes in 20th century "antiques," including gramophones.

See: https://www.tripadvisor.com/Attraction_ ... ijing.html

The thing to avoid is what is known as a "Crap-O-Phone," which I understand is readily available in China, India, etc.. These are relatively easy to spot, once you familiarize yourself with their key features.
If you do an online search for Crap-O-Phone, you'll probably find dozens of references.

The reason to stay away from them is because of their horrible build quality and sound quality. They in no way are similar to the quality outside horn models produced during the early part of the 20th century.

OrthoFan

Good morning.

I have been searching online and have only found new players or "crapophones".

There is some Pathé machines locally, I will go out and test them before purchasing one. Thank you friends.

chuckmoy wrote: Wed Jun 18, 2025 8:40 pm Good morning.

I have been searching online and have only found new players or "crapophones".

There is some Pathé machines locally, I will go out and test them before purchasing one. Thank you friends.

Keep in mind that a Pathé gramophone may not play your 78s. If the reproducer's Mica diaphragm is facing forward--towards the front of the cabinet --then it was designed to play vertical cut Pathé records.

All standard 78 have a lateral groove cut. If it has a conventional tonearm with the front of the diaphragm facing sideways then it should play standard 78s.

If you do a Google image search for Pathé phonograph or gramophone, you'll see what I about the tone arm and reproducer.

chuckmoy wrote: Wed Jun 18, 2025 8:40 pm Good morning.

I have been searching online and have only found new players or "crapophones".

There is some Pathé machines locally, I will go out and test them before purchasing one. Thank you friends.

Pathé potentially opens a can of worms. Pathé for many years made so-called "vertical cut" records; what you have are what is known as "lateral cut." In a nutshell, the way a record makes sound is that the groove wiggles ("modulates") and in doing so causes the stylus or needle to move in concert with it, in turn vibrating the diaphragm in the reproducer. A "lateral cut" record, which is the most common type of 78, has the groove modulating side-to-side, which is to say parallel the record surface. Some manufacturers, particularly Pathé and Edison, recorded with a groove that modulates up and down, perpendicular to the record surface, instead; this configuration is known as "vertical cut." These records took special jewel styli to play, not the steel needles that were universal for lateral cut disks. Eventually, Pathé shifted over to lateral cut, like about everybody else, and the one I saw in your posting elsewhere is from that period. Here's the thing, though: Pathé spring-driven *machines*, if from the period up until the early 1920s or so, probably will be designed to play only the company's own vertical cut records from the period, and that won't do you any good. Here's how to tell the difference: if the reproducer's diaphragm points straight ahead, it's for vertical cut. If it points to the side, it will play only lateral cut. Sometimes you'll find a machine, including some Pathé models, that can do both by twisting the reproducer around. You'll want to be careful to get a machine that will play laterals, though. Here are a couple of videos that will show you how the reproducer should be arranged.

Example of a machine configured to play vertical cut--not what you want:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wm5rjQ7j0Q The camera zooms in on the reproducer at around 40 seconds. Note how the reproducer diaphragm faces forward.

Example of a machine configured to play lateral cut--what you want:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvoNdZjq8U0&t=3s Note how the reproducer faces to the right.

Here are two photos of a Pathé machine with a "universal" reproducer setup that can play either type. Note how it's set at about a 45 degree angle to the tonearm. This is a US Pathé upright machine from ca. World War I or a bit later; I don't know if the company offered this design in China.
I don't know to what extent things may have been different in China, but this is how they were in Europe and the United States. I hope this isn't too confusing and that it will help you find a machine that will work for you.

Good morning.

I see. I should look for the slanted reproducer, vertically cut.

There is also I think a partial phonograph at a market I pass by during school lunch, I think it had a low price. I will check it and report back with a new post.