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I'm new to collecting Victor items so this is a newbie question.

I know Victor had other locations in the U.S. besides Camden and locations in other countries.
Did these other facilities just produce items for Camden or did they produce complete products that left their facility to the consumer?

The reason I ask this is, since there were other facilities, does any Victor logos on their macines or other items state the item came from some place other than Camden or does all Victor items say Camden no matter wether they were made at another facility?

For instance, the inside hood for my Victrola says Camden, N.J., does someone have a machine or other item that gives another origin in their logos and if so, are site specific items collectible based on where they were made?

I believe all machine manufacture was in Camden. Early on even the British stuff was built there for the Gramophone Company. I understand that motors and reproducers were imported from Camden until well after the construction of the Works at Hayes. The Canadian, Mexican and South American machines were also made in Camden, as were the Japanese products until the construction of the Japan Victor Works at Yokohama in 1927.

Victor did open a record pressing plant and recording studio in Oakland, CA in 1924. Other VTMC and Gramophone company facilities were located in Montreal (Canadian Berliner), Yokohama (Japan Victor Company), Sidney (Gramophone Company), Santiago (VTMC), Buenos Aires (VTMC), Hannover (Deutsche Grammofon AG), Milan (Gramophone Company), Paris (Gramophone Company), Dum Dum (India) and St. Petersburg (Gramophone Company).

Most of the above were recording studios warehouses and administrative offices. Hannover was a large plant, serving much of the Continent, until the Great War cut it off from London. St Petersburg and Milan had pressing plants rather early on. Santiago and Buenos Aires were both pressing discs by the early 1920's, there were assembly plants, and some cabinet shops (as at Dum Dum), but the machine tools used to make the parts of the Victrola motors, which while they seem simple at first glance require very advanced and accurate machine work were too expensive and specialised for it to have been practical for manufacturing to have been distributed over the face of the globe.

I've owned two Victrolas and one Vic II that came with cast tone arms. These differed from typical Victor tone arms which were made by forcing water through a brass tube. The cast tone arms are heavier and the little pivot food is part of the casting. Two out of the three machines with cast arms came from Canada. I've always wondered if they came from a Victor plant in Canada. Jerry Blais

The Berliner Gram-O-Phone Company in Montreal operated as a separate company until Victor bought the controlling interest in 1922. They did indeed manufacture in Montreal, especially in the years before 1910 when Berliner had its own line of machines . The interesting thing is that the later ones have tone arms that look on first glance , like those of Victor but the parts are not interchangeable. After 1910 or so the Berliner machines became essentially the Victor line of open horned machines and Victrolas, but in the transition period there was a good degree of overlap with machines from both lines being offered. The Montreal plant was big, and the machines were certainly assembled up here, but it is my understanding that a certain amount of parts and cabinets were made here in Canada .
Here's a pic of a corner of the Montreal plant in 1910 ( or so) . Note the pile of non-Victor motors on the table to the right.
Jim

Jerry B. wrote:I've owned two Victrolas and one Vic II that came with cast tone arms. These differed from typical Victor tone arms which were made by forcing water through a brass tube. The cast tone arms are heavier and the little pivot food is part of the casting. Two out of the three machines with cast arms came from Canada. I've always wondered if they came from a Victor plant in Canada. Jerry Blais

Of course when Emile Berliner was enjoined by the Courts from producing and selling his inventionmhe moved to Montreal, and assembled machines there. The early Canadian Berliner machines were generally variants on the "Trademark" gramophone. The Berliner company eventually modrnized its product line, and for a time offered all manner of interesting Canadian designed machines, many of which were modeled on contemporary Victor designs, but were manufactured in a plant equipped qith machine tools which were far less sophisticated than those at Camden. This more primitive factory floor inevitably affected the design the products. After the Tarriff Reforms of 1910 the Berliner group began importing most talking machines and parts directly from Camden. Victor even made a number of special models specifically for the Canadian market.

The special model Victrolas came at a much later date. The Orthophonic era was the golden age of the Canadian Victrola models .There was only one "acoustic" era Victrola that was unique to the Canadian market. The plant by the late teens was by no means primitive. It was the RCA Victor Canada plant until the demise of RCA. One of the buildings is still standing in Montreal But of course nothing like the Camden enclave.

Lenoirstreetguy wrote:The special model Victrolas came at a much later date. The Orthophonic era was the golden age of the Canadian Victrola models .There was only one "acoustic" era Victrola that was unique to the Canadian market. The plant by the late teens was by no means primitive. It was the RCA Victor Canada plant until the demise of RCA. One of the buildings is still standing in Montreal But of course nothing like the Camden enclave.

Well primitivism is relative. There were any number of entirely satisfactory talking machine motors mass produced in the 'teens, but the Victor motor required more sophisticated automatic machinery than most other designs. Warner and Swayze designed an entire series of automatic screw machies and automated turret lathes tomserve the needs of Victor. The capital cost of much of this equipment was so great that even after the Gramophone Company was assembling its own model 32 and 34 motors, with frame castings, springs and governor weights manufactured at Hayes, the automatic screw parts were still imported from Camden. When RCA dsicontinued the prOduction of motor parts at Camden, Hayes turend t o other sources of supply, including Columbia and Garrard.

Uncle Vanya wrote: The capital cost of much of this equipment was so great that even after the Gramophone Company was assembling its own model 32 and 34 motors, with frame castings, springs and governor weights manufactured at Hayes, the automatic screw parts were still imported from Camden. When RCA dsicontinued the prOduction of motor parts at Camden, Hayes turend t o other sources of supply, including Columbia and Garrard.

Pardon my ignorance, but what are these automatic screw parts supplied by Victor, and what parts did the Hayes factory have to acquire from other sources including "Columbia & Garrard"?
UK Columbia never made their own motors, but had them supplied BY Garrard with the Columbia name on them, so why would HMV/GC be buying motor parts from a company that never made motors?
I've always thought the first Columbia/Garrard motors & parts to hit the floors of the Hayes factory were stocks obtained from Columbia with the EMI merger of 1931, but if not I'd be very interested in sighting the source of the above information.
I also thought HMV stopped using any American made Victor cabinets by about 1909/10, & started making their own Exhibition soundboxes in around 1911, and by the start of WWI they had also started making their own complete motors, eliminating the need to rely on Victor for anything, except for the designs used.

Since we're on this topic, here's a couple of more pics of the"old" Berliner factory on Lenoir Street. The record stock room gives an idea of the size of the place before the "new: buildings went up in the teens. The record mixing room is the flip side. Doesn't that look like fun? Not.

How telling of photographs. Looks like OSHA might file suit on the owners descendants for all that soot in the air and under their noses in the first photo! Seems like someone would get the idea to tie a bandanna on their face sooner or later...