A and B 250 Database Project

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Marty Bufalini
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Re: A and B 250 Database Project

Post by Marty Bufalini »

Imagine if you could discover who was the family of the original owner?
Fran, I forgot to mention that I did purchase it from the original family. It was in her family since new. It also came with some Diamond Discs.

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fran604g
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Re: A and B 250 Database Project

Post by fran604g »

Marty Bufalini wrote:
Imagine if you could discover who was the family of the original owner?
Fran, I forgot to mention that I did purchase it from the original family. It was in her family since new. It also came with some Diamond Discs.
That's really cool, Marty!

Best,
Fran
Francis; "i" for him, "e" for her
"Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while" - the unappreciative supervisor.

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DGPros
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Re: A and B 250 Database Project

Post by DGPros »

Hey Fran, I know it's not an A-250 or B, but I thought it would help corroborate with the A series anyway. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe these were #'d in sequence with the A-250, then they started new #'s with the B's. That would make sense, since only a few hundred of these were made.(Frow states on page 121 that 352 total sales, as of Dec. 31st 1914.

I don't know how these keep finding me? :roll:


1) Model designation on the data plate? A275

2) What is the serial number on the dataplate? SM-5709

3) What is the number stamped into the top of the motor-plate beneath the turntable? 5709-A275

4) While you have the turntable removed, how many oil “ports” are present on the top of the motor-plate? 2 plus spindle.

5) Looking at the underside of the motor-plate (if you are able to) how many oil “tubes” are present? 4+1.

6) What is the “Date” on the paper label stuck to the inside of the cabinet rear inspection door? Label is present and great condition yet no date present. Form 632-

7) What is the stamped number on the “1st Horn Joint” located directly below the motor mechanism? 5963
8) What is the stamped number on the “2nd Horn Joint” just before the horn flairs out? 5963

9) Is there a number conspicuously stamped into the cabinet on the bottom of the horn compartment? Yes there is a number, 5709, though the 7 is an upside down 2. I have seen this done before. and visible only when the inspection door is open.

10) What color is the motor-plate finish? Brown
10b) None

11) What color is the pin striping on the perimeter of the motor-plate? Gold with corner decorations.

12) Is the operating lever (lowers the reproducer for play) mounted to the “Cabinet”

13) Which type of start/stop lever configuration does your unit have? Type 2

14) What is the cabinet wood type? Mahogany.

15) Are there “Tone Slots” cut into in the sides of the cabinet? No

16) Is the horn painted in “Mahogany Wood Grain”, “Oak Wood Grain”, or “Black”? Mahogany Wood Grain.

17) What type of record storage system does yours have; there are slots for individual record storage.37 slots which fits 38 records

18) Is there an “Official Laboratory Medallion” mounted to the turntable trim piece? No.

19) Is there “grille cloth” present? If there is; what color is it, and please provide a brief description of the material. Yes, diamond shape, with a o in the middle. My guess is original almost definitely.

20) Are there any dealer tag(s) or decal(s) present? yes, on rear bedplate 1 ¾ by ¾" Reed,Dawson & Co.,Inc. Musical Instruments and Music 6 West Park Street Newark N.J.

21) What is the "Cabinet Factory No." (if any)? None that I can find.

22) Does your cabinet have a conspicuous “Lip” around the inside top perimeter of your turntable compartment? No

23) How tall is your Phonograph, measuring from the bottom of the right front foot up along the cabinet corner frame piece (do not include the caster if one is present, please) turntable compartment corner? 43 ¾

24) Are there any sales receipts, shipping documentation, etc., original to the phonograph? No

She is in very nice shape. With some cleaning the inlay should POP.
Attachments
2018-06-23 15.24.13.jpg
2018-06-23 15.01.57.jpg
2018-06-23 15.02.09-2.jpg
2018-06-23 15.25.52.jpg
In short, is not liberty the freedom of every person to make full use of his faculties, so long as he does not harm other persons while doing so?
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fran604g
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Re: A and B 250 Database Project

Post by fran604g »

Thank you, Gary. That's a worthy "off-topic" addition to the database. As for the serial numbering, I really can't say with certainty that the A 275 was included in the block reserved for the A 250. There's certainly speculation that all of the 250 horn sized "A" series machines may have been, but I have seen no comprehensive proof of that. I'd love for that topic to show some "light" one day - it would be nice to know how the Edison Co. divied up their serial number blocks overall. :)

I'd love to see some photos after you're done cleaning it up.

Thanks again,
Fran

EDIT: That grille cloth material pattern and color is eerily similar to the original grille cloth my 1-C came with. I wonder if the material was used in others over the years?
Francis; "i" for him, "e" for her
"Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while" - the unappreciative supervisor.

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DGPros
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Re: A and B 250 Database Project

Post by DGPros »

Will do. I think I'll start another post so as not to hijack this thread about the Numerology of these Edison.

Update, I found the thread. Figured I'd post it here http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... 275#p81746 It does look like they were part of the A-250 numerology.
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DGPros
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Re: A and B 250 Database Project

Post by DGPros »

Hey Fran,

This one is not mine, but a friends. He just gave me the information over the phone. If you have any questions I can find out or put you in touch with him if you like.




1) Model designation on the data plate? "A250"

2) What is the serial number on the dataplate? "SM - 5082"

3) What is the number stamped into the top of the motor-plate beneath the turntable? Example: 5082-A1 (Location shown in pictures below)

4) While you have the turntable removed, how many oil “ports” are present on the top of the motor-plate?2 top right bottom left

5) Looking at the underside of the motor-plate (if you are able to) how many oil “tubes” are present?4

6) What is the “Date” on the paper label stuck to the inside of the cabinet rear inspection door? torn off

7) What is the stamped number on the “1st Horn Joint” located directly below the motor mechanism?5202

8) What is the stamped number on the “2nd Horn Joint” just before the horn flairs out? (This one may be difficult to locate without disassembly, so please don't go out of your way for this one).5802

9) Is there a number conspicuously stamped into the cabinet on the bottom of the horn compartment? If there is; what is the number, and is it in the “Front” or “Rear” of the horn compartment?5082

10) What color is the motor-plate finish? “Chocolate-Brown”

10a) Is there a "Tone control or Mute Ball" present, "Yes"; if yes, then which type? "Pivoting Lever and Cable"

11) What color is the pin striping on the perimeter of the motor-plate? “Gold”

11a) Is there decorative pin striping applied to the corners of the motor-plate? “Yes”

12) Is the operating lever (lowers the reproducer for play) mounted to the “Cabinet”

13) Which type of start/stop lever configuration does your unit have? “Type 2”
14) What is the cabinet wood type? "Mahogany", or "Oak".

15) Are there “Tone Slots” cut into in the sides of the cabinet? “No”.

16) Is the horn painted in “Mahogany Wood Grain”

17) What type of record storage system does yours have; “17-A”

18) Is there an “Official Laboratory Medallion” mounted to the turntable trim piece? no

19) Is there “grille cloth” present? Yes , reddish, pretty obvious a replacement

20) Are there any dealer tag(s) or decal(s) present? No

21) What is the "Cabinet Factory No." (if any)? None, "H" stamped into wood front left hon compartment

22) Does your cabinet have a conspicuous “Lip” around the inside top perimeter of your turntable compartment? “Lip”

23) How tall is your Phonograph, measuring from the bottom of the right front foot up along the cabinet corner frame piece (do not include the caster if one is present, please) turntable compartment corner? 44 ½"

24) Are there any sales receipts, shipping documentation, etc., original to the phonograph? Dated and serialized materials are particularly noteworthy. "no"


Turntable is marked 5082, motor is marked -8-24 There may be another # before the 8 which we can't see at this time.
In short, is not liberty the freedom of every person to make full use of his faculties, so long as he does not harm other persons while doing so?
Frederic Bastiat

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fran604g
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Re: A and B 250 Database Project

Post by fran604g »

Thank you, Gary. I think this data collection would be stalled if not for your diligence. :)

Best regards,
Fran
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"Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while" - the unappreciative supervisor.

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DGPros
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Re: A and B 250 Database Project

Post by DGPros »

Hey Fran, I came across another A-250. I don't believe I've ever seen the drawers #'d like this, unless I just forgot.(The bottom drawer has holes as if one had been attached) I wasn't sure if you are still taking the information, but here it is.

1) Model designation on the data plate? A-250

2) What is the serial number on the dataplate? SM-4611

3) What is the number stamped into the top of the motor-plate beneath the turntable? 4611-A1

4) While you have the turntable removed, how many oil “ports” are present on the top of the motor-plate? 2

5) Looking at the underside of the motor-plate (if you are able to) how many oil “tubes” are present? 4+1.

6) What is the “Date” on the paper label stuck to the inside of the cabinet rear inspection door? Label is present and great condition yet no date present. Form 632-8-10-13

7) What is the stamped number on the “1st Horn Joint” located directly below the motor mechanism? 4693
8) What is the stamped number on the “2nd Horn Joint” just before the horn flairs out? 4693

9) Is there a number conspicuously stamped into the cabinet on the bottom of the horn compartment? 4611

10) What color is the motor-plate finish? Maroon
10b) None

11) What color is the pin striping on the perimeter of the motor-plate? Gold
12) Is the operating lever (lowers the reproducer for play) mounted to the “Cabinet”

13) Which type of start/stop lever configuration does your unit have? Type 2

14) What is the cabinet wood type? Mahogany.

15) Are there “Tone Slots” cut into in the sides of the cabinet? No

16) Is the horn painted in “Mahogany Wood Grain”, “Oak Wood Grain”, or “Black”? Mahogany Wood Grain.

17) What type of record storage system does yours have; 17F removable though the # index holds them in place. Bottom drawer has concave dividers

18) Is there an “Official Laboratory Medallion” mounted to the turntable trim piece? No.

19) Is there “grille cloth” present? If there is; what color is it, and please provide a brief description of the material. no

20) Are there any dealer tag(s) or decal(s) present?no

21) What is the "Cabinet Factory No." (if any)? 632-8-10-13 (is that the date? 8/10/13)
22) Does your cabinet have a conspicuous “Lip” around the inside top perimeter of your turntable compartment? No

23) How tall is your Phonograph, measuring from the bottom of the right front foot up along the cabinet corner frame piece (do not include the caster if one is present, please) turntable compartment corner? 44 ½

24) Are there any sales receipts, shipping documentation, etc., original to the phonograph? No
Attachments
20210322_102649.jpg
20210322_102643.jpg
20210322_102858.jpg
In short, is not liberty the freedom of every person to make full use of his faculties, so long as he does not harm other persons while doing so?
Frederic Bastiat

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fran604g
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Re: A and B 250 Database Project

Post by fran604g »

Thank you Gary, I haven't encountered this one either. I'm sure the number strip was someone's addition, it's a smart idea! I haven't seen any others numbered in any way, and don't think this was provided from the factory.

21) What is the "Cabinet Factory No." (if any)? 632-8-10-13 (is that the date? 8/10/13)

I believe such dates found with the Factory No. stickers, correlated to when the cabinet was final inspected at the factory. I can't be sure, though.

I'll add this to my spreadsheet.

Best,
Fran
Francis; "i" for him, "e" for her
"Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while" - the unappreciative supervisor.

1913Concert
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Re: A and B 250 Database Project

Post by 1913Concert »

Hi, this is a great project and I am looking forward to seeing the results. I have always been interested in these early Diamond Disc phonographs as there is so much variation in them. So here goes for mine:

#1 A250
#2 SM 9113
#3 9113-A-1
#4 7 oil holes, two with covers
#5 4 oil tubes for sure perhaps more visibility poor
#6 4-3-14
#7 & #8 The only number visible is 9349 on the collar into which the flared portion of the horn inserts and clamps
#9 At the rear in the frame for the back door 9113
#10 Black
#11 No
#12 Gold
#13 Type 2
#14 Mahogany
#15 No
#16 Mahogany Wood Grained
#17 Top Drawer 17-A, Bottom Drawer 17F Most of the dividers removed so that each drawer has 4 compartments
#18 No
#19 Has original grille cloth which appears to be a very fine silk fabric the color of which is brown with gold highlights. Iridescent in the light
#20 No
#21 No cabinet sticker
#22 Has lip
#23 44.25
#24 Sadly, no documentation

Other little interesting things: The serial number 9113 is written in crayon on the underside of the turntable, inside the cabinet to the rear are three screw eyes with fragments of green cord on them that look as if they might have served to secure the horn in transit?

Good luck with the project! Bob Murray

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