Triumph problem #2 tracking.

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AmberolaAndy
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Triumph problem #2 tracking.

Post by AmberolaAndy »

Well since my break issue is resolved! I’m starting a new thread for this issue.

Now earlier today my Triumph was playing sorta good. So I thought I would put my cygnet on it. And it skipped no matter how I adjusted the spring holding the horn, so I took off the cygnet and started playing records with just the 14 inch horn. I noticed it gained this issue where it would start really slow speed up and play normally then near the end of records it would skip.

So I thought I would take the advice offered in my other thread and redo that screw and adjust the carriage a hair as said. Well doing that just made the skipping/bogging down WORSE and no matter what I do I cannot get it to track!

I’m really ready about to give up with this half nut and just do what I did with the speed Yoke and go get a replacement online!

gramophoneshane
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Re: Triumph problem #2 tracking.

Post by gramophoneshane »

Probably the best idea, and least frustrating, is to get a new half nut.
The threads are pretty fine and don't take an awful lot to make them wear just enough to stop them working efficiently.
I've had to replace a couple over the years that worked when I got the machine but within a couple weeks of use they needed replacing.

Probably due to wear caused by a lack of oil, possibly decades ago, they were on their last legs, and even after being cleanied and oiled, using the machine again fairly regularly over that brief period was enough to polish off the last of what little thread kept it working properly,
Half nuts aren't really expensive, so when you find you're having to keep adjusting them because they'll work briefly then start skipping again and need readjusting, it's much easier to just install a new one and not have to touch it again for years.

Being brand new, you'll find it will seat properly on the rod first go and there's less chance of it moving while it's secured to the arm, so you've only got to fiddle with the pressure screw, and once that's right, it's going to stay right for years.
Even good originals can take a couple tries to seat properly because of minimal wear that can increase the chance the nut isn't sitting perfectly straight and flat along the rod because there's slightly less thread to bite into each other
Last edited by gramophoneshane on Fri Jun 17, 2022 11:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

AmberolaAndy
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Re: Triumph problem #2 tracking.

Post by AmberolaAndy »

gramophoneshane wrote: Fri Jun 17, 2022 11:08 pm Probably the best idea, and least frustrating, is to get a new half nut.
The threads are pretty fine and don't take an awful lot to make them wear just enough to stop them working efficiently.
I've had to replace a couple over the years that worked when I got the machine but within a couple weeks of use they needed replacing.

Probably wear caused by lack of oil possibly decades ago they were on their last legs, and even after cleaning and oil, using the machine again fairly regularly over that brief period was enough to polish off the last of what thread kept it working properly,
Half nuts aren't really expensive, so when you find you're having to keep adjusting them because they'll work briefly then start skipping again and need readjusting, it's much easier to just install a new one and not have to touch it again for years.

Being brand new, you'll find it will seat properly on the rod first go and there's less chance of it moving while it's secured to the arm, so you've only got to fiddle with the pressure screw, and once that's right, it's going to stay right for years
Yup probably my best bet! If not replacing the carriage entirely.

Here’s a photo of them.
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image.jpg
image.jpg

gramophoneshane
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Re: Triumph problem #2 tracking.

Post by gramophoneshane »

Looking at your photo, I noticed the arm that holds the half nut is missing the nickelled top plate which holds the pressure adjustment screw.
Do you have that or is it missing?

It's that silver plate that ends in the middle of the half nut arm.
That holds the pressure adjustment screw that applies pressure to the arm so the half nut is pushed downward and stays seated on the threaded rod.
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IMG_20220618_140639~2.jpg

AmberolaAndy
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Re: Triumph problem #2 tracking.

Post by AmberolaAndy »

gramophoneshane wrote: Fri Jun 17, 2022 11:58 pm Looking at your photo, I noticed the arm that holds the half nut is missing the nickelled top plate which holds the pressure adjustment screw.
Do you have that or is it missing?

It's that silver plate that ends in the middle of the half nut arm.
That holds the pressure adjustment screw that applies pressure to the arm so the half nut is pushed downward and stays seated on the threaded rod.
Yeah I don’t have that part. Probably the reason I’m struggling to get it to work.

Here’s a closeup of the half nut
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gramophoneshane
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Re: Triumph problem #2 tracking.

Post by gramophoneshane »

My picture above is actually my Home, but all my Homes and Standards, as well as my spare carriages all have the same or similar plates with the pressure screw.

Is your Triumph a Model B?

gramophoneshane
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Re: Triumph problem #2 tracking.

Post by gramophoneshane »

It's pretty difficult to tell from a picture and even in person, how warn a half nut is, to me anyway.
Sometimes it's easy because half the threads are gone and it's warn smooth, but other times it's not so obvious.

I've never owned a Triumph, but looking on the internet, some Triumphs have that plate and others don't.
The ones that don't however, appear to have a different half nut bar to yours.
These have 4 screws holding the half nut, and the bar itself is kind of divided down the middle, so I'm not entirely sure if you're missing that top plate, or even if yours is the correct half nut bar.
It looks to me as if the 4 screws are really holding 2 half nuts, and that brass casting the bar screws onto is completely covered by the bar which means you bar is narrower than the 4 screw 2 nut variety.
Last edited by gramophoneshane on Sat Jun 18, 2022 1:00 am, edited 1 time in total.

AmberolaAndy
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Re: Triumph problem #2 tracking.

Post by AmberolaAndy »

gramophoneshane wrote: Sat Jun 18, 2022 12:52 am It's pretty difficult to tell from a picture and even in person, how warn a half nut is, to me anyway.
Sometimes it's easy because half the threads are gone and it's warn smooth, but other times it's not so obvious.

I've never owned a Triumph, but looking on the internet, some Triumphs have that plate and others don't.
The ones that don't however, appear to have a different half nut bar to yours.
These have 4 screws holding the half nut, and the bar itself is kind of divided down the middle, so I'm not entirely sure if you're missing that top plate, or even if yours is the correct half nut bar
Honestly I’m not 100% sure. I’m apparently supposed to turn the screw and adjust that whole part as seen in this photo, but I’ve been doing that and it’s absolutely not working no matter how much!
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gramophoneshane
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Re: Triumph problem #2 tracking.

Post by gramophoneshane »

Ah ok, I can see a bit more detail in that photo, and it appears the black carriage arm basically clamps to the metal sleeve to which that whole half nut bar assembly is attached.
It also appears your Triumph is a Model A, correct?

To me that half nut bar assembly looks correct but if it's an A I'll see what other A's have got.

If that carriage and metal tube assembly is the only way to adjust half nut pressure, then it's an extremely silly way to have to adjust half nut pressure.
Last edited by gramophoneshane on Sat Jun 18, 2022 1:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

AmberolaAndy
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Re: Triumph problem #2 tracking.

Post by AmberolaAndy »

gramophoneshane wrote: Sat Jun 18, 2022 1:09 am Ah ok, I can see a bit more detail in that photo, and it appears the black carriage arm basically clamps to the metal sleeve to which that whole half nut bar assembly is attached.
It also appears your Triumph is a Model A, correct?

To me that half nut bar assembly looks correct but if it's an A I'll see what other A's have got.

If that carriage and metal tube assembly is the only way to adjust half nut pressure, then it's an extremely silly way to have to adjust adjust half nut pressure
It’s a model B triumph with added 2 and 4 minute gearing. The one in that photo is JerryVan’s. I agree. I dunno if the half nut itself is screwed in wrong?

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