L Door Victrola Album Question

[phonojim]

There are two or three different types of the boxes, so you need to know the correct one for your machine. The Victor Data Book has the information regarding the proper boxes/albums for the different models of the VTLA/XVI. If you don't have a copy of the book, mention it and I'll try to post the info later.

When I bought my L door VTLA (early 1907, s/n 32XX), the seller asked if I wanted a box of records he had in the garage to go with it. Well, DUH! Turns out the records were crap but there were two of the original record boxes from that machine! I haven't actively looked for any more, but the machine is so nice that I would like to complete it someday.

Jim

[oldphonographsteve]

The Victor Data Book has the information regarding the proper boxes/albums for the different models of the VTLA/XVI. If you don't have a copy of the book, mention it and I'll try to post the info later.

I am afraid I don't have that book, but I would be very appreciative if you could post the info!

[phonojim]

According to the Victor Data Book, the last VV-XVI shipped with boxes was type B with serial #17960. The first one shipped with albums was type C with serial #17961. The albums had brass pull rings, the same as used on the boxes and held from 15-17 records.

Jim

[De Soto Frank]

I would question this a bit.

My suffix-C L-door was sold by John Wanamaker & Sons, in Philadelphia in early 1910. The date on the License Label is August 1, 1909. Serial # 19362.

The machine is in very good original condition, and has a complete set of Box Albums.

The invoice from Wanamaker states "Victrola and Records", and I would say that 90% of the records are "Patent Label" Victor that seem to be from the 1909-1910 era, and they seem to be in "excellent" to "like new" condition...

I suppose it is possible that someone could have swapped-in a complete set of box-albums after my machine left Camden... unfortunately, I do know know the history of the machine prior to my ownership.

I will post a photo of the invoice when I have access to that computer file.

[52089]

According to the Victor Data Book, the last VV-XVI shipped with boxes was type B with serial #17960. The first one shipped with albums was type C with serial #17961. The albums had brass pull rings, the same as used on the boxes and held from 15-17 records.

Jim

My type C has a s/n in the low 20000 range and has boxes. It had 8 when I got it and I finished the set this year. I would find it very hard to believe that someone swapped out albums for boxes, especially when the machine came to me with no albums.

[De Soto Frank]

Here are some pictures of my machine, VV XVI - C, s/n 19632, with the box-albums, which bear the patent date April 14, 1908.

[martinola]

According to the Victor Data Book, the last VV-XVI shipped with boxes was type B with serial #17960. The first one shipped with albums was type C with serial #17961. The albums had brass pull rings, the same as used on the boxes and held from 15-17 records.

Jim

I can well believe that this is accurate, but we have to remember that the serial numbers do not always represent the absolute order of production or shipping. 17961 may well have been the last one out of the door with boxes, but other higher serial numbers may have preceded it. The difference in serial numbers looks to be in the 2-3000 range. That's probably not much more than a month's production on a popular model. To me, it is quite conceivable that there should be some blur when switching from one accessory to another.

I imagine to someone doing the final preparation, record holders are record holders whether they be boxes or albums. The issue probably wasn't so important to them, but it's quite a bit more important to us. You guys have some cool machines. (Shoot, now I really want a VTLA! )

Martin

[oldphonographsteve]

According to the Victor Data Book, the last VV-XVI shipped with boxes was type B with serial #17960. The first one shipped with albums was type C with serial #17961. The albums had brass pull rings, the same as used on the boxes and held from 15-17 records.

Jim

I can well believe that this is accurate, but we have to remember that the serial numbers do not always represent the absolute order of production or shipping. 17961 may well have been the last one out of the door with boxes, but other higher serial numbers may have preceded it. The difference in serial numbers looks to be in the 2-3000 range. That's probably not much more than a month's production on a popular model. To me, it is quite conceivable that there should be some blur when switching from one accessory to another.

I imagine to someone doing the final preparation, record holders are record holders whether they be boxes or albums. The issue probably wasn't so important to them, but it's quite a bit more important to us. You guys have some cool machines. (Shoot, now I really want a VTLA! )

Martin

I totally agree with Martin on this subject, the factory probably just was using up their remaining stock of record boxes on some machines while implementing the new record albums on others. Since my machine has a serial number of 36984 C, I would probably find it more likely based off of all the information you all have given me (thanks!) that mine use the albums with the green sleeves. The question I have now is, which albums are these exactly? Are they the ones which have the 15, 16, or 17 sleeves? Thanks!

[De Soto Frank]

According to the Victor Data Book, the last VV-XVI shipped with boxes was type B with serial #17960. The first one shipped with albums was type C with serial #17961. The albums had brass pull rings, the same as used on the boxes and held from 15-17 records.

Jim

I can well believe that this is accurate, but we have to remember that the serial numbers do not always represent the absolute order of production or shipping. 17961 may well have been the last one out of the door with boxes, but other higher serial numbers may have preceded it. The difference in serial numbers looks to be in the 2-3000 range. That's probably not much more than a month's production on a popular model. To me, it is quite conceivable that there should be some blur when switching from one accessory to another.

I imagine to someone doing the final preparation, record holders are record holders whether they be boxes or albums. The issue probably wasn't so important to them, but it's quite a bit more important to us. You guys have some cool machines. (Shoot, now I really want a VTLA! )

Martin

Martin, good point...

As for having a "cool machine", I'm very lucky to own it. I stumbled across it by accident a number of years ago, at the warehouse of a local chap who does a lot of estate clean-outs. He would open the front of his warehouse on Saturdays for a sort of Flea market, then every other month have an auction to move the large furniture.

One Saturday I stopped in, and noticed "an unusually tall Victrola"... when I got up close, I saw the "L-doors", and how nice the mahogany finish was... it got better when I saw the album boxes with records, and then the dealer produced the original invoice & key. . (Thank goodness I had gotten a copy of "The Talking Machine: an Illustrated Compendium" the previous Christmas !)

It wasn't cheap, but my wife said "okay", so out came the master-card, and home came my L-door Victrola.

I haven't regretted it... ( although I would like a VTLA with the frieze... )

Sometimes we gets lucky.

[Bob]

Frank, Very nice L door you have. The box albums you have look mint. A very lucky find for sure. I was also lucky to get mine with the boxes. They are not quite as nice as yours thou.
Bob