Edison Opera Buying Advice

[HisMastersVoice]

You should pay attention to the presence of a piece of steel wire inside the flywheel of the motor. It should be visible from the outside, and its function is to act as a spring and stabilize the rotation. When I bought mine, the wire was there but not aligned correctly, so the speed was all over the place until I found out about the role of this wire (it is more like a rod, it is quite rigid), put it back in place and the machine has worked fine since.

The Amberola V has this flywheel wire as well. It was missing/broken when I got mine, and I got a piece of new wire from Wyatt Markus, of which I still have a piece left, somewhere...I couldn't believe the difference that little wire made in stability!

[JerryVan]

Brandon,

If it matters to you, be aware that many of the horn elbows are reproductions. I think some were, in the past, made of fiberglass. Others are nicely made of metal. You can spot the metal variety by the presence of a copper sleeve at the base of the elbow, where it slips into the mount on the machine. I'm not aware of any original elbows having that copper sleeve.

Also, many times the wooden horn bells are taken from Music Master radio speakers and re-purposed for use on Operas. Look for proper, original Opera decals on the horn. Refinished horns, or those with new decals are always suspect.

[JerryVan]

I'd like to find a mahogany Opera, not a Concert. The Concert is too plain looking for me.

Just to clarify, the model name "Opera" was renamed to "Concert" due to a copyright conflict with the U-S Talking Machine Co. - it had nothing to do with the cabinet style or type of wood.

I understand that it has nothing to do with the type of wood. I guess I am referring to the deletion of the handles on the sides, which I was to understand coincided with the change of the name. Perhaps not. To rephrase, I am looking for an earlier model mahogany Opera. Oak is nice, but if I'm spending that kind of money, I don't want to settle for a second choice.

My Concert (Opera) has a mahogany case, with handles. Every Concert/mahogany example I've seen, (and I've certainly not seen them all), has handles.

[HisMastersVoice]

Brandon,

If it matters to you, be aware that many of the horn elbows are reproductions. I think some were, in the past, made of fiberglass. Others are nicely made of metal. You can spot the metal variety by the presence of a copper sleeve at the base of the elbow, where it slips into the mount on the machine. I'm not aware of any original elbows having that copper sleeve.

Also, many times the wooden horn bells are taken from Music Master radio speakers and re-purposed for use on Operas. Look for proper, original Opera decals on the horn. Refinished horns, or those with new decals are always suspect.

Jerry, I actually did find an Opera over the weekend, and I do know the elbow and horn are original. (Photos are here).

Just for the sake of curiosity and perhaps to help others, are there any telltale signs of re-purposed Music Master radio horns other than the decals?

[Valecnik]

Brandon,

If it matters to you, be aware that many of the horn elbows are reproductions. I think some were, in the past, made of fiberglass. Others are nicely made of metal. You can spot the metal variety by the presence of a copper sleeve at the base of the elbow, where it slips into the mount on the machine. I'm not aware of any original elbows having that copper sleeve.

Also, many times the wooden horn bells are taken from Music Master radio speakers and re-purposed for use on Operas. Look for proper, original Opera decals on the horn. Refinished horns, or those with new decals are always suspect.

Jerry, I actually did find an Opera over the weekend, and I do know the elbow and horn are original. (Photos are here).

Just for the sake of curiosity and perhaps to help others, are there any telltale signs of re-purposed Music Master radio horns other than the decals?

Yours is legit. The re-purposed radio horns don't carry the Edison decal, just Music Master decal, they are usually glossier piano finish and have been refit into the collar.

[JerryVan]

Brandon,

If it matters to you, be aware that many of the horn elbows are reproductions. I think some were, in the past, made of fiberglass. Others are nicely made of metal. You can spot the metal variety by the presence of a copper sleeve at the base of the elbow, where it slips into the mount on the machine. I'm not aware of any original elbows having that copper sleeve.

Also, many times the wooden horn bells are taken from Music Master radio speakers and re-purposed for use on Operas. Look for proper, original Opera decals on the horn. Refinished horns, or those with new decals are always suspect.

Jerry, I actually did find an Opera over the weekend, and I do know the elbow and horn are original. (Photos are here).

Just for the sake of curiosity and perhaps to help others, are there any telltale signs of re-purposed Music Master radio horns other than the decals?

Brandon,

Excellent example. Congratulations. Just off hand, the decals are the only tip-off I'm aware of. maybe some others can offer some other ways to spot a repurposed radio horn.

[HisMastersVoice]

For the potential benefit of others, here's a photo of the decals on my horn:

[tinovanderzwan]

i see nobody mentioned the price for an opera
the prices range from the bottom mark of 5000,-$ and as much as 9000,- for the top mark for a reasonable looking machine to mint
i've seen lower prices but those where damaged or scrappers very incomplete and such
parts like reproducers, bedplates, casses, motors and horns do pop up from time to time on ebay if your handy and you dont mind to wait than that could be an second option

opera's nearly always come from a collection barn finds are rare and far between aldough they do happen


tino

[HisMastersVoice]

My Concert (Opera) has a mahogany case, with handles. Every Concert/mahogany example I've seen, (and I've certainly not seen them all), has handles.

It turns out it was mahogany vs. oak I was referring to, not Opera vs. Concert. The oak Opera/Concert does not have handles. My mistake.

[EarlH]

Brandon,

If it matters to you, be aware that many of the horn elbows are reproductions. I think some were, in the past, made of fiberglass. Others are nicely made of metal. You can spot the metal variety by the presence of a copper sleeve at the base of the elbow, where it slips into the mount on the machine. I'm not aware of any original elbows having that copper sleeve.

Also, many times the wooden horn bells are taken from Music Master radio speakers and re-purposed for use on Operas. Look for proper, original Opera decals on the horn. Refinished horns, or those with new decals are always suspect.

Jerry, I actually did find an Opera over the weekend, and I do know the elbow and horn are original. (Photos are here).

Just for the sake of curiosity and perhaps to help others, are there any telltale signs of re-purposed Music Master radio horns other than the decals?

Brandon,

Excellent example. Congratulations. Just off hand, the decals are the only tip-off I'm aware of. maybe some others can offer some other ways to spot a repurposed radio horn.

The larger of the two music master radio horns use the same bell, so if it's been refinished with new decals, there is no way to know for sure. Of course if it's the small bell from a radio horn it's obvious. The bell should be put on the collar with burnt shellac and then those very small screws replaced.
I would be more frustrated at getting one where they have reamed open the small screw holes to put larger screws in (and I've seen stove-bolts used) than about if it started out on a music master radio horn. If it has a reproduction collar, that would be a big tip-off because the radio horn uses a different style connection than the phonograph does. I've seen a few of the reproduction collars and the original one's are nicer, but I haven't refinished or worked on any Opera's for about 10-12 years now and don't know if they are better with the reproductions now or not. Most of the radio horns have the decal on the front of the horn as it faces you and to me look quite stupid. If you look around the rim of the horn you should be able to see a shadow if they just sanded the old decal away or washed it off.
The older reproduction horn bells have a fiberglass core and the veneer doesn't always stay put on those. I don't know what the new mahogany bells are like. If it has an old un-refinished bell and an old collar, it's probably correct. Make sure your bell is cemented on like it's supposed to be though as you don't want it to drop off on the floor and split in two! I refinished one for a guy that had that happen. The burnt shellac works well and if you need to get the collar off in the future, you'll be able to. Well, good luck with your purchase now. It looks like a nice machine. The one I had years ago came with an L reproducer and the serial number was in the 600's also! I got it from the second owner and it came with about 450 records both wax and blue amberol. They really are nice machines.