Imperial No. 2 restoration

[jboger]

I decided to start a new thread on this. I couldn't resist opening up the machine and taking a look at the motor. All there . . . well it looks as if the governor has been canibalized of its weights and the mainspring has been removed. I consider this not too bad.

So with regards to the mainspring, I just spoke with Ron Sitko. He needs one dimension that I don't have: the thickness of the mainspring. I can supply him with all other dimensions but this one. So just to be clear. Don't need the length nor the width (which is an inch), but the thickness, the smallest dimension. I expect it to be somewhere around 1/32 of an inch, maybe less.

So, does anyone out there in the Forum know that dimension? Yours truly would be eternally grateful.

John

Realized last night that I can get the measurement from the Standard Model A. Same mainspring barrel. JB

[Phonofreak]

I'm looking forward to seeing the progress. I really like the Columbia client machines. If you need any help, or have questions, I'll be glad to help.
Harvey Kravitz

[jboger]

Harvey: Thanks for the offer. I will take you up on it. Right now I have more projects than time. I got the Standard Model A and the Imperial a week apart. I have the unfortunate tendency to bring projects up to a certain point then stop. I want to reverse that trend with the Model A. I bought it complete, down to the screws and everything. A real pleasure when nothing is missing. Victrolaboy has told how to rebuild the reproducer; it should be easy. The point is, I want to finish that machine off, then the Imperial. In the meantime, however, I have taken the motor apart and uploaded some pictures that I hope people will find interesting. I need to take the Standard apart to get at the mainspring. It might be interesting to compare motors.

I do have a question for you and anyone else on the Forum. Are any Imperials known with the brake/speed control on the top of the motor board? I've seen both ways for the Model A.

John

[Victrolaboy]

The thickness of the mainspring for that motor is .028 inches.

[Phonofreak]

On Standard Model A's, and other Columbia Client machines, I have seen them both ways. The early ones from about 1908-1911-12, used the early push-pull brake and speed control. The later ones from about 1912-20 used the speed control on the top of the motor board. Cataloged Columbia machines used the push-pull speed control from 1902-08. Then they started using the later speed control after 1908 until the end of production.
Harvey Kravitz

[jboger]

Thanks, Victrolaboy (Nick). I just confirmed your measurement and got a mainspring thickness of 0.70 mm, which translates to 0.0275 inches. So we're in agreement.

I have compared the Imperial No.2 motor with the Standard Model A. They are quite similar. Many parts, maybe even all, are interchangeable. The mainspring barrel arbors are different. I believe they are interchangeable, but the Imperial has a reverse threaded screw at one end of the arbor to keep the arbor from slipping. The Model A has no such beast. Also I could swap spindles if I wanted to and convert my Model A into a machine that plays regular ol' records.

The motor platforms are cast from different molds and have different mold numbers. Overall they are the same. I could swap parts from one platform to the other. However, I could not switch motors between the two machines. Bolt holes don't quite line up--almost, but not quite.

The Standard platform has a serial number stamped into it using individual number punches. I bet it is a Columbia serial number. Perhaps it could be used to date the machine? The platform also has two small capital letter H's stamped into it (H H). The Imperial has a place for the serial number, but nothing is stamped there.

That's it for now. I'll post pictures of the mainspring arbors so people can see the difference.

[Lucius1958]

On Standard Model A's, and other Columbia Client machines, I have seen them both ways. The early ones from about 1908-1911-12, used the early push-pull brake and speed control. The later ones from about 1912-20 used the speed control on the top of the motor board. Cataloged Columbia machines used the push-pull speed control from 1902-08. Then they started using the later speed control after 1908 until the end of production.
Harvey Kravitz

Good to have that info: now I have an approximate date for my BZH.

Bill

[jboger]

I put this post under this thread although I first wrote about my Standard Model A under a different topic. I just played a record on it, probably the first record played on the machine in fifty years. I thought I needed to get new governor weights as so much lead oxide sloughed off I thought they were underweight. No, the weights are fine. I hadn't cleaned the governor properly when I disassembled the machine. The two parts to the governor must slide smoothly if it is to work properly. It was frozen. I cleaned and oiled it all up. Things slide smoothly, and the motor is now quiet and running at the proper speed.

The record I got by chance. When I went to bid on the Imperial, I stopped off at a "Junque Shoppe." The store (not really a junk store) had lots of 78s. $3 each seems to be the going price around here. Mixed in all these records was one "standard" by the Standard Talking Machine Co. So I bought it. I still need to rebuild the reproducer. (Thanks, Nick.) But even now my Model A sounds pretty good. The horn needs to be repainted. But that's a job for another day.

Save for the reproducer, I consider this job done for now. Which means I can turn my attention to the Imperial.

[jboger]

A few days ago I received my new mainspring and governor weights from Ron Sitko for the Imperial. Had to wait until the weekend before I could start anything. Long story short, the motor is now running. So it's on to rebuilding the reproducer.It has the original aluminum diaphragm. I started to take the dried gasket out a few days ago but stopped shortly into the job. Curiously enough, there is only one gasket; the diaphragm is not sandwiched between two gaskets. Rather, the one gasket has a slit along its length into which the diaphragm fits. You can this in the photos. New to me, Thought others might like to see it.

[Victrolaboy]

That sure is stange... is the diameter of the tubing larger than regular gasket tubing used for an exhibition?