Victor VI price?

[gramophone78]

There are several horn options which would be correct on a Victor VI.
1- mahogany spear point horn (most commonly found horn on a Victor VI)
2- #24-B all brass Flower horn
3- black paper horn. This horn is found on earlier Victor VIs and there are at least one rare variation of this horn. In the advertising of the day, these horns were described as "rubber" horns.
4- larger brass belled horn with metal wood grained body. I suspect Victor had difficulty importing the paper horn and offered this horn for a very short time.

Can anyone think of another horn offered by Victor for a Victor VI or 6?

You could find an "after market" horn on a Victor VI. Perhaps the owner did not like the Victor options or his horn was damaged so he purchased a horn sold by his local dealer. In my opinion a nice after market horn is correct and very interesting on a Victor VI or any Victor machine and these outfits would have good value.

There are many horns that will fit a Victor VI but would not be correct. Any horn from a Victor II or larger machine, right up to a #24 Flower horn, will fit but really are not correct. (The #24B and #24 horns are the same size but the "B" horn is all brass and the regular #24 horn is painted black with gold trim.

Many collector prefer a Victor horn on a Victor machine. I believe that any machine with an appropriate after market horn is correct and equally or possibly more desirable. The key word is "appropriate" and sometimes that's open for some debate.

I hope this helps. Jerry Blais

I think Jerry has hit the nail on the head with this information.
As previously mentioned....the higher $$$ end of the scale (condition aside), would include... "horn", (my opinion of rarity) brass bell wood grained body, paper mache horn with red interior, all brass 24b flower horn, paper mache all black, wood spear tip....etc... Reproducer (again in my opinion) #10 sound box, plain gold concert, gold Exhibition.

Victor advertised the paper mache horn as "having the appearance of polished hard rubber".

[Raphael]

Steve,

To begin with, I quoted you $400, not $500, with shipping by FedEx. If you go on line to FedEx, you can develop a quote on your own, and I guarantee it will cost you at least twice that amount; after 30+ years of shipping I have deep discounts with them and the two boxes involved (one 25" x 25" x 25" and the other at 19" x 19" x 19") have a "Dimensional Weight" of over 163 lbs. Dimensional weights are calculated by multiplying the cubic dimensions (in inches) and dividing by 139. FedEx and other carriers charge by the higher of either the actual weight or dimensional weight.

I ship phonographs and other items almost every day of the week and not only know what it takes to pack them properly, but what the actual shipping costs are. Quite often, to save money, my Chinese customers insist on sending stuff by USPS and I go nuts trying to explain to them that USPS will not accept the 25" horn package as it is too large.

By the way, the packing materials to ship a Victor VI cost me about $100. Everything gets double-boxed, using heavy-duty, double-wall boxes, new packing materials, etc.

In summary, better to over-pack and have everything arrive safely. Nobody is happy when damage occurs, and good luck trying to collect on insurance. I "self-insure" and if it arrives damaged I end up eating the costs.

thanks,
Raphael

[flashpanblue]

Hello,
Shipping over seas is expensive. I recently shipped an Edison Triumph to Leeds U.K. The lowest rate I could find was $300.00 and that was just for the machine without a horn.
Pete

[Steve]

Yes, it appears the U.S. has finally caught up and possibly even over-taken the U.K. for high shipping costs. Anyway, I accept the need for "over the top" packing with an instrument like this.

Have any of you experts got an opinion on the originality and condition of the example on eBay I posted a link to? I appreciate it's about $2500 too expensive but I'm intrigued by the declaration of the seller that it's all untouched and in near mint original condition. I've been looking at pictures of machines online for nearly 20 years so I've got a fairly good feel for things that look right or anything that looks "touched up". I'm wondering if anyone else shares my scepticism about this particular machine.

Anyone dealt with this seller before?

[AZ*]

Have any of you experts got an opinion on the originality and condition of the example on eBay I posted a link to?

Anyone dealt with this seller before?

I do not believe it's original. The decal on the back bracket looks like a repro to me. The originals had finer gold lines often highlighted in blue.

The seller says he polished the cabinet. I suspect reamalgamation top-coated with shellac. Others are welcome to their opinions, but I've seen thousands of Victors in 40+ years of collecting, including 100s of Victor VIs.

I don't think it's original like the seller claims. I know nothing about this seller.

[Steve]

Thank you, Wayne and Jerry, for the precise history of VI variations and horn specifications. It appears the fluted mahogany horn and Exhibition sound-box might be the most commonly seen version of this machine and therefore the least valuable on paper.

Thank you also to AZ. You've confirmed my thoughts on the current eBay example: some re-amalgamation of the shellac finish, and replacement decals / striping at the very least.

It's a curious thing that the cabinet finish has signs of "alligatoring" (which is expected with age and perfectly acceptable) whilst the horn looks very shiny and flat without any signs of age. Re-finishing the surface is an absolutely no no for me personally. If a finish is so bad or non existent so that a cabinet needs re-polishing that is one thing but tampering with an aged shellac polish that has normal and perfectly acceptable light alligatoring and fading commensurate with age is not something I would ever consider doing so an expensive machine in this condition is not for me. As far as I'm concerned they have ruined that machine and destroyed any sign of its age and history - it might just as well be a new reproduction.

I'll gladly pass on it and wait for a genuine untouched machine to appear for the right money.

[Retrograde]

...and the seller just ruined the whole thing by playing a Hank Williams record on it in the video! <undergoing a regurgitative spasm>

[PHONOMIKE]

Have any of you experts got an opinion on the originality and condition of the example on eBay I posted a link to?

Anyone dealt with this seller before?

I do not believe it's original. The decal on the back bracket looks like a repro to me. The originals had finer gold lines often highlighted in blue.

Actually, the Victor VI or 6 never had blue on the back bracket. It was always only the gold striping on it. The Victors I through V had gold with some blue highlighting.

Mike

[AZ*]

Actually, the Victor VI or 6 never had blue on the back bracket. It was always only the gold striping on it. The Victors I through V had gold with some blue highlighting.

Mike

Interesting. I've learned something. I know I've seen Victor VI's with blue on the brackets. They must have been swapped from a V.

Most of the many VI's I've seen over the years were either darkened with age, had something wrong with them, or like the one on ebay, were over-restored.

I'm still convinced that the decal on the bracket is most likely a reproduction. I would need to see it in person. Either way, the ebay machine is not worth $7500.

[Valecnik]

Well there were a couple very nice ones posted on the forum here recently offered for $5-6k. You could get one cheaper if you are really lucky but or are less than fussy about condition.

Bruce, any chance you could kindly point me to the links for those please? Doing a search in this forum for "Victor VI" brings up several hundred links with just about anything lossely associated with Victor!

Here are the two I was thinking of Steve. One was mine.

http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... or+Sale%3A
http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... or+Sale%3A