A-250 and the Amberola Ghosting?

[DGPros]

I've been meaning to post this for quite sometime. My machine (A-250 SM1593) has what appears to be an Amberola emblem coming through on the underside of the lid. Does anyone else notice this on theirs? Could it be anything else but the Amberola emblem? I had read that they were going to use "The Discus Thrower " emblem till they realized it was already used. Hmmmm.

[phonogfp]

It certainly looks like the lid started out as that for an Amberola 1A/1B. (Forget about the discus thrower...) Check the cabinet on the right side where the lid closes to see if there's a semi-circular filler block where the Amberola cabinets have a cutout to aid in cylinder removal/insertion.

George P.

[DGPros]

I looked but didn't see anything, though I'm not exactly sure where or what I'm looking for. Could you post a picture? I'll double check again tomorrow when I'm a little more awake.

[phonogfp]

Here is a photo from the Antique Phonograph Society website; in an article called Encountering Antique Phonographs.

http://www.antiquephono.org/encounterin ... onographs/

If you look on the right side of the playing compartment, you'll see the semi-circular cutout and the corresponding addition to the lid. Look for signs of these Amberola characteristics having been filled/removed on your A-250.

George P.

[Valecnik]

A few additional additional pieces of information that may provide clues.
- Look at where the lid support is mounted to the lid. Do you see evidence of it being mounted earlier further forward? Amberola 1-A lids were mounted further forward so that that lid was held open at a 30 degree angle versus 45 like on a 1-B or DD. (Of course your cabinet could have been made over from a 1-B also.
- As suggested by George, an Amberola cabinet would have had the cut out, (to slide the record on/off more easily)on the right side of the cabinet. Do you see any evidence that the cut out has been filled or that the whole right top might have been cut down and made over with a new piece of wood.
- Look inside the cabinet through the back for any evidence of additional holes which may have been drilled for the Amberola mechanism before it was re purposed.
- Measure the height of the cabinet, lid open, in a precisely described location such as center front, over the center top of the crenelation to over the top of key escutcheon on top. A cabinet originally designed as an Amberola cabinet should be ~ 2 inches shorter than almost all A-250s. (42 vs. 44 inches at that point).
- Finally, easiest last I guess, does it have the side louvers?

Post some pictures of the detailed areas and of the machine as a whole if you can, good pics in bright light if possible. The rework done to modify the cabinet would have obviously been very well done and concealed at the factory. With this information, it's likely you should be able to prove or disprove your theory.

[DGPros]

Let me start off by saying the pictures are reversed and 2nd: the machine had been painted yellow and green so I've been told by the previous owners son. (Maybe he also put a sticker on the lid)or maybe removing the paint also removed the layer that caused the emblem to show...either way this is what I have so far.


Picture 5
Lid support: Those markings seem WAY to far forward and vertical. 14 ½ " mark. ( they are prominent and definitely not stains.
Picture 4
There seems to be two dots at 16 and 17 mark on the lid.(dowels?) I'm chalking this up to stains though because
Picture 3
Markings where the cut out should be has a few stains at 13 ½ and 14 ½ along with 11 ¼ and 8 ½
Picture 2
Height of cabinet is "from the floor" 45". If the crenelation is the bottom of the skirt (my words) it's 43 ¼"
Picture 1
Yes it has the Louvre on the sides.It is an early model,(1593 all parts marked as such) but I don't think I've found any compelling evidence that it was an Amberola emblem. (measure approximately 6" by 4"). I hope to give her a good cleaning and will look inside then. At the moment nothing on the body shows filler or replaced parts in my opinion. Thanks for your input. Gary

[fran604g]

Hi guys,

I hope you don't mind my getting involved here, I'm no expert, but at some point when I was looking for A/B 250 posts, I came across posts of this unit and saved images for my reference. After reviewing the images, this is the only one I found that shows this defect clearly enough to suggest the cabinet may have actually been an Amberola cabinet modified into a Disc Phonograph cabinet.

This is the post that has the images: http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... ilit=A+250

If you look carefully at one of the images attached to the above post, you can see a defect on the top rim of the turntable compartment that suggests the Amberola relief cut may have been present and later filled in. See the "defect" that I circled below:

Best,
Fran

[DGPros]

Thanks Fran,
I had hoped this thread would produce information such as yours, and what others have stated before you. I had done some inspections on the A-250, but wanted to read, and learn opinions from the more informed on the forum. Thanks again.

[fran604g]

Thanks Fran,
I had hoped this thread would produce information such as yours, and what others have stated before you. I had done some inspections on the A-250, but wanted to read, and learn opinions from the more informed on the forum. Thanks again.

You're welcome. I also saw a post of an A-250 cabinet that showed this relief cut filled in with an actual semi-circular piece of wood that was glued in place. Pretty neat stuff, IMO.

Fran

[Valecnik]

Thanks Fran,
I had hoped this thread would produce information such as yours, and what others have stated before you. I had done some inspections on the A-250, but wanted to read, and learn opinions from the more informed on the forum. Thanks again.

You're welcome. I also saw a post of an A-250 cabinet that showed this relief cut filled in with an actual semi-circular piece of wood that was glued in place. Pretty neat stuff, IMO.

Fran

In the case of my A-300 you can see the whole side was cut down about ¾ of an inch and replaced. You might look for that sort of repair too.