Phonograph Auction in Tacoma on CL

[CDBPDX]

http://portland.craigslist.org/clk/atq/5224595206.html

Sanford & Son Antiques and Auctions of Tacoma, WA - auction of the Marlowe Roeser estate, including many vintage phonographs. Looks like a real exciting place to be.

Forgive me if this has already been posted...

Cliff

[Bruce]

Cliff

Thanks for posting. Even with our weak dollar this auction looks work the two and half hour drive.

Bruce

[CDBPDX]

Went to the auction last night. There was a lot of good stuff there. The most active bidding was on the Victor VI - went for $3250 plus fees. The Edison Home model E with the 10 panel cygnet and model K reproducer went for $325 plus fees, the Edison Standard model B with a reproduction horn sold for $225. A small tin toy type machine complete and working went for $150.

There were several kinetoscopes and picture series to go with them, those went for $300 to $500 each. There were many sets of stereoscopic pictures and viewers, there was heated bidding on those. I ended up buying a nice Columbia upright with several cool records with an adaptor for Edison machines to play lateral records. There were only about 40 people there (about 30 bidders) and a lot of the antique furniture went for next to nothing. A very deluxe old oak pump organ (working) with extensive carving went for $100.

Attached are a few pictures of the items coming up in the second auction (they estimate there will be 5 auctions).

It was fun! Cliff

[Ripduf1]

Hi Cliff, What is the % Fee (commonly called Buyers Penalty) at this auction house? Also is there state sales tax that has to be added as well to the total and what is that %? Thanks! John

[gramophone78]

The Vic. VI actually sold for $3500 plus 15% buyers and 9.5% sales tax.

It has a few issues....

The horn is a Canadian Berliner wood grained paper mache with many cracks and losses.

The crank is a later Victrola nickel crank (black knob) that had been cut and made into a slotted crank.

The crank escutcheon plate area had been messed with and the hole in the case enlarged and holes drilled for "machine screws"... .

Oh, and the case appeared to have been worked at some point.

In my opinion.....very over priced considering you were buying a machine without the correct "factory" horn.... . *Edited for accuracy*

image.jpeg (162.8 KiB) Viewed 1909 times

image 8.jpeg (222.79 KiB) Viewed 1909 times

image 9.jpeg (142.34 KiB) Viewed 1909 times

[miker2001]

The 3500 bid over the phone couldn't be confirmed, so I thought it went to a floor bid of 3250
I thought the E went for 500.

[gramophone78]

The 3500 bid over the phone couldn't be confirmed, so I thought it went to a floor bid of 3250
I thought the E went for 500.

The lot started with an absentee bid of $1500 and closed with a "confirmed" bid of $3500. They were trying for $3750 with no success.

A friend was the under bidder...even though I advised him to pass on it after a certain amount.

I have no knowledge regarding the other lots.

[phonogfp]

In my opinion.....very over priced considering your were buying a machine without the correct horn.... .

I'm not sure that "without the correct horn" is quite true. Perhaps "aftermarket horn" might be more accurate.

The horn is a Spaulding Linen Fibre Horn. The company was based in Rochester, New Hampshire, and advertised in The Talking Machine World from January-April 1908. These horns were available in either a quartered oak pattern or a mahogany pattern, as seen on the auction example. They were distributed by the Berliner Gramophone Company in Canada, so that accounts for the decal. These horns originally sold for $8.00.

George P.

[gramophone78]

In my opinion.....very over priced considering your were buying a machine without the correct horn.... .

I'm not sure that "without the correct horn" is quite true. Perhaps "aftermarket horn" might be more accurate.

The horn is a Spaulding Linen Fibre Horn. The company was based in Rochester, New Hampshire, and advertised in The Talking Machine World from January-April 1908. These horns were available in either a quartered oak pattern or a mahogany pattern, as seen on the auction example. They were distributed by the Berliner Gramophone Company in Canada, so that accounts for the decal. These horns originally sold for $8.00.

George P.

Thank you George. I agree. It was not the correct "factory" issued horn.. .

The machine was also not a Canadian sold machine as it lacked the Canadian Berliner "sole distributor" plate which is attached to all units sold in Canada below the Victor data plate.
So, being a US sold machine....it should really not have a Canadian Berliner "sold" horn on it....of course this is only my opinion.. .

I have also seen these Spaulding made horns sans decal in both oak & mahogany grained finishes. Perhaps one like that would be more correct as an "after market" horn for this machine...?.

[phonogfp]

Thank you George. I agree. It was not the correct "factory" issued horn.. .

The machine was also "not" a Canadian sold machine as it lacked the Canadian Berliner "sole distributor" plate which is attached to all units sold in Canada below the Victor data plate.
So, being a US sold machine....it should really not have a Canadian Berliner "sold" horn on it....of course this is only my opinion.. .

I have also seen these Spaulding made horns sans decal with both oak & mahogany grained finish. Perhaps one like that would be more correct as an "after market" horn for this machine...?.

The fact that this Victor VI was auctioned in Tacoma suggests that its original home may have been near the Canadian/US border. Such regional proximity may have sometime resulted in perfectly legitimate purchases by the original owner which, over a century later, might be frowned upon by modern collectors.

We walk a fine line between striving for "originality" and accidentally destroying it. Many period photos demonstrate that original owners sometimes strayed from "catalog correct." Yet, do we as collectors honor those configurations when we find them in the wild?

For me, the answer is, "It depends." If there's evidence to suggest that a machine was equipped in a "non-standard" manner by the original owner, I'm likely to preserve the combination as found. How many of us make sure that a Tea Tray horn is always supported by a Tea Tray crane? Chances are, a smaller rural dealer would have carried only one line of horns and cranes. Still, I doubt too many of us refuse to mix a Hawthorne & Sheble product with a Tea Tray.

Disc machines offer less chance of this sort of thing. Even so, I'd prefer a Spaulding horn over the more common Victor No.31 ("spear-tip") horn. I'm not arguing condition - - just horn-for-horn interest. I admit that I'd find this combination more historically convincing in the northern latitudes rather than along the Gulf Coast.

Unfortunately, we modern collectors constantly struggle with 50-60 years of tinkering by "collectors" and dealers. Virtually all of us try to either avoid those results or attempt to make them right. In these instances, "catalog correct" is really the only way to go because all those improper screws, polyurethane, mis-matched parts, and extra holes show that originality is already lost. The Victor VI in question is perilously close to the edge, but if I found that machine in the wild here in western New York State, I'd be inclined to fix the obvious depredations but keep the horn on it.

As always, just one guy's opinion!

George P.