Getting Started with cylinder recording

[Sterling Cooper]

Thank you for pointing out these factors. I will attempt to address them in further recording efforts.

[Chuck]

Well, making your own recordings on cylinders can
be as involved or as simple as you would like it to be.

The test using the speaker and the witch's hat horn
is a good one to start with. It's easy. It's simple.
But, as you mentioned, it leaves something to be desired
as far as the quality of the recording.

There are 3 main makers of brown wax blanks these days.
Paul Morris is in the UK. Shawn Borri and myself
are in the USA.

One secret to making better recordings on cylinders
is to do a lot of it. Much comes with experience.

One can collect Edison recorders, and learn to rebuild
them, and even learn how to make some of the missing parts. Each Edison recorder sounds a bit different than
any other. They each have unique qualities. This
is why people who get serious about recording have
several different recorders to choose from.

That goes for recording horns too. One could have a large assortment of differently shaped, and different
sized recording horns and speaking tubes.

Try all different kinds of blanks including originals.
I shall not say here which blanks I consider to be
the best...but perhaps you can take a guess...

Get a shaving machine. Get a dial or digital calipers
to accurately measure the outside diameter of your
blanks. You can even use shaved down Dictaphone
blanks. Those actually work quite well. I started
with those long before I made my first brown wax blank.

But most of all, do a lot of it and gain experience, and
be patient. It's not an easy nor a quick thing to
master. It takes time. Your recordings will get better
as you learn how.

Chuck

[Lucius1958]

The first of those recordings (due obviously to the quality of the blank, and the outside temperature) sounded to my poor ears as good as any studio recording from the 1890s.

Bill

[edisonphonoworks]

I also have to say practice practice. I have made thousands of cylinder recordings. Temperature is important 80-90F surface temperature, or better yet environment. I also say a 3" diameter by 24-30" cardboard horn, is good for most voice and singing records. I will admit my blanks are hard to come by, I work 48 hours a week, so blanks are a hobby. I sell on a first come, first serve basis, that is you can't just order them. I make from a few hundred to a thousand of them a year, although I have slowed the process down quite considerably to concentrate on higher quality, not at all worried about quantity, so 100 or 50 blanks a year, will probably be normal. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0Hb28ePqpo

https://youtu.be/o2k7XWK9B3E


https://youtu.be/MpVHs5nTa_k

https://youtu.be/je3sVx-MFkc

[edisonphonoworks]

Illinois now has become a mecca of cylinder activity, and all within a less than two hour drive, North American in Princeton, Illinois, Richards Laboratories in Waynsville, and Victrola Guy, Benjamin J in Pekin IL. I onetime gave a recording demonstration about 20 years ago for the Pekin Bottle Collectors Club.

[Chuck]

Thanks for the nice comment Bill!

That concert which was put on by the
Illinois 33rd Regiment volunteer civil war marching
band was shaping up to be a most outstanding opportunity
to record some cylinders live.

It was a very hot sunny day in central Illinois the
day of the concert. The outside temperature was well
up into the 90s. It was supposed to be outside, but
storm clouds began gathering, and at the last possible
minute, they decided to move inside, which was a HUGE
disappointment for me.

So, we all went inside the small auditorium at the park
where the concert was being held.

They had that place air-conditioned down to about 70
degrees inside. That felt outright cold compared to
the outside temperature. So, when you hear those short
snippets of the live-recorded cylinders from that day
in 2010, just bear in mind that the temperature was
only 70 degrees. That, in my humble opinion is about
the rock-bottom temperature at which cylinders can be
recorded. 80 degrees would have been much better, and
had the concert been held outside in the blazing
90+ degree hot summer, those recordings most likely
would all have been much much better than are.

By the way, it never did rain even one drop that day...

Oh well, maybe next time...

Chuck

[edisonphonoworks]

https://youtu.be/-fIh58RNUXw
This is what a .008 glass recording diaphragm sounds like, this is a professional recording attachment, used by Walter H Miller, in my opinion some of the finest acoustical recording equipment ever made. The glass is suspended, without touching the side, as well as the cutting stylus floats on the diaphragm cell, and connected to the body with burnt rubber two neoprene gaskets on the bottom and two on the top, each gasket has burnt rubber dampening between, and the burnt rubber sticks the diaphragm to the body when it dates from, my guess around 1910. This is a test by dubbing from an MP3.

[ambrola]

Welcome to the forum. I am Shawn Borri, and I am kind of a thorn in the side of the collector community. I am more of an audio mad scientist than a collector. But I have recorded a few thousand cylinders and make phonogram recording blanks. If you check out the post of myself and Chuck Richards you will find much on the subject of cylinder recording and record making. Dubbing is best done making a little cardboard horn, big enough to encapsulate a 3-5" full range speaker, sealing the end of the horn, roll low bass 30-100 cps 8 db, increase the 250 cps range 4db and decrease mid range in the 1000 and 3000 cps range 5db, increase the 6-10,000 cps range 8db where it falls off. This is where I get the best dubbing on most cylinders. most talking records make with a 30" long by 3" end horn, band records, a 56" brass horn, a 36" brass cone horn works well too for instrument recording. For solo instruments a 25" long by 6" opening cone horn works well. You can make the cone horns out of poster board or manillia cardboard folders, rap them with electrical, or masking tape. speak about 2-3" from the horn use an even spaced diction, and constant volume. S's and ch sound emphasized, if you give an old man style consonants with a slightly whistled effect intelligibility with be increased.

Come on Shawn, we all aren't as smart as you. I don't understand any of this? I have always just used a 14 inch horn and played into it with good results. If your having volume trouble, check the cutter on the recorder? I play guitar and have used my Amp. next to the end of the horn and recorded some real good stuff.

[edisonphonoworks]

A 14" horn Certainly a good start, and was the first horn I used, It is not bad for dubbing , if you put a full range speaker in a corner, and point the horn at it, this is a simple method, with an even volume.

[edisonphonoworks]

I will also say, like Chuck did, that a good home recorder, can do very good work. For instance, Peter Dilg has a certain home recorder he uses for many of his WiZard record releases, it does use rubber gaskets and a glass diaphragm, but still in all other respects it is a home recorder, and you all know how outstanding his recordings are! (He does use a studio phonograph with large flywheel. The most common Edison recorder is equipped with a .002" thick mica diaphragm and this is good, as it is very sensitive, most studio recorders had glass diaphragms .005-.008". A poor recording is usually the result of some fault with the recorder, perhaps the wax seal has been compromised, patch any missing wax with beeswax,and heat a small screwdriver in an alcohol flame, or lighter, and re flow the wax, a little goes a long way, just the outer edge needs to be sealed, also use some stratina, or shellac to secure the stylus holder to the diaphragm. As long as the stylus is good,and the diaphragm is sealed, it should work. I have noticed though that each recorder does sound different than another. It is also wise to find a copy of How to Make Records At Home With An Edison Phonograph.

Here is the introduction. Making amateur records on the Edison Phonograph. Making Phonograph Records may properly be compared to amateur photography. The first efforts are disappointing. The first pictures made by the amateur are crude and unsatisfactory, and it takes time, care and study to produce good ones. In making Phonograph records the same care and persistence is necessary. The amateur should not set his standards to high. He should not think he can make records equal to Edison Gold Moulded Records now sold, for he will probably never be able to do so. It has taken years of study and experimentation on the part of Mr. Edison and his assistants to produce records of this quality and volume.
When we state that with all their experience an facilities, our experts often find it necessary to make a dozen records to get one that is up to the high standards of Edison Gold Moulded Records, one can understand why our records are unequalled,and,also why it is impossible for an inexperienced amateur with but one recorder at his disposal, to secure the same results.
However ,amateur records are not made for commercial purposes , but are justly valued because of the personal element that enters in there production. what does mother care if the record of baby's first words is not loud-it is her own dear child's voice which in after years will be priceless to her and the grown child. Again, the record of a friend's singing or instrumental work may be technically faulty in reproduction, but is prized for its cherished associations. After all, the wonder and pleasure of hearing one's own voice or music reproduced amply repays the amateur for the care and patients necessary in making records. And by repeated trials, and careful attention to instructions here given,results are sure to be achieved that will be eminently satisfactory. 26" long by 6" is the recommended horn for general recording.