Victor IV Phonograph Restoration Thread

[Garret]

Hello everyone! Lady Luck paid me a visit recently, and I managed to acquire a Victor IV phonograph project from an auction in the Midwest. However, I have a few questions about the cabinet and also the tone arm, which can be seen below. Any thoughts you can offer would be appreciated!

1. Is the back of the cabinet supposed to have three holes, as shown?
2. Is the tone arm missing anything, especially where the set screw is at the back? If so, what is it?
3. Does the tone arm look usable in spite of the large dent in the back?

Best,

Garret

[Phonofreak]

Garrett, Here are the answers to your questions:

Hello everyone! Lady Luck paid me a visit recently, and I managed to acquire a Victor IV phonograph project from an auction in the Midwest. However, I have a few questions about the cabinet and also the tone arm, which can be seen below. Any thoughts you can offer would be appreciated!

1. Is the back of the cabinet supposed to have three holes, as shown?
Yes the three holes are correct. The left and right holes is where the back bracket bolts hold the tone arm to a plate. The center hole is for a bolt to go through to hold the plate.


2. Is the tone arm missing anything, especially where the set screw is at the back? If so, what is it?
The tone arm looks complete. The set screw in there. You will have to loosen the set screw to see if the rod is complete or broken.


3. Does the tone arm look usable in spite of the large dent in the back?
The tone arm is usable, but i would have someone remove the dent so it swings easily. Maybe John Duffy, the Hornman can do this?? Good luck with your project. It will be worth the effort to restore.
Harvey Kravitz
Best,

Garret

[gramophone78]

Just to clarify a couple things....

The back bracket mounting plate is held in place by a slotted machine screw and washer....not a bolt.

The tone arm pivot pin that is attached to your tone arm is broken. There should be a male end on the lower end, like you see on the top end (only narrower). There should be a second (shorter) part of the pivot pin in the back bracket with a female end. This pin in the bracket is spring loaded.I believe Sitko sells a replacement.

It may be difficult to have the dent removed. It's worth trying, because finding another arm will not be easy.

[Garret]

Gramophone78,

Thank you for the additional information. So there should not be a third hole between the other two for the bracket, then?

Best,

Garret

[gramophone78]

Gramophone78,

Thank you for the additional information. So there should not be a third hole between the other two for the bracket, then?

Best,

Garret

Yes, the center hole is for the machine screw and washer that holds the bracket mounting plate in place (see attached). Garret, you may find this funny....if you look carefully at the paper label inside the case, you can see the three holes in the plate... .
By the way, if you have a drill press or know someone who does....you could drill out the broken end of the pin and insert (with crazy glue) a new pin into the main body. Although, originally the large part of the pivot pin is one piece of steel rod. Better to just buy a repro from Sitko.

[Garret]

"Garret, you may find this funny....if you look carefully at the paper label inside the case, you can see the three holes in the plate.."

Oops! LOL!

[gramophone78]

"Garret, you may find this funny....if you look carefully at the paper label inside the case, you can see the three holes in the plate.."

Oops! LOL!

It's amazing how detailed Victor made their labels. You can learn a lot from them sometimes.

Just so you understand.....when the plate is mounted...the only part you will see on the outside of the case is the machine screw and washer. You do not need to over tighten this screw. Just enough to hold the plate in place and allow you to thread the two bracket bolts.

What horn came with your machine..... black & brass, 22" flower, small mahogany or mahogany spear tip ??.

[Garret]

There was no horn with this particular example when I got it. Once the motor and case are sorted out, I will look for a horn. A collecting friend here in northern Virginia has offered to sell me a metal petal horn, which is nice, but I'd prefer to source a black and brass or mahogany horn. All in time!

With a little oil, I was able to get the broken pin out the tone arm without any problem. I'll reach out to Ron and see what he has in the way of replacements. This is one of many small parts either broken or missing. While most of the important pieces are here, someone clearly started to disassemble this phonograph with the intention of repairing it, only to never complete the job.

Thank you for the help, everyone!

Best,

Garret

[Garret]

Well,

I disassembled the motor yesterday, and quickly hit a few snags.

1. The two spring barrels appear to be of different age, and I noticed that they have an ever so slightly different lip where the cap slips into the barrel.
2. The outer barrel appears to have a screw shoved into it, and also rotates in a fixed manner with the winding gear.
3. From weight, it feels like one of the barrels doesn't even have a spring!

Does it look like the second spring barrel with the larger rivet has been tinkered with? At this point, I am thinking of sending the motor out for surgery to George Vollema.

[gramophone78]

The one barrel may be slightly later or was cleaned when serviced. Clearly the original pin has been replaced by something much bigger...like a screw.They may have simply used a screw to connect the barrel to the shaft. So, you will need to buy a spring and add an inner pin (on the shaft) and an outer pin (on the barrel). It will also depend on if there is more damage caused by this screw addition. You won't know until you open it up.

I also don't see the speed control rod retention spring (a small coil spring)or governor. You can see the spring in my pic next to the governor friction disc.

Why not rebuild the motor yourself..??. They are not hard to do and if the spring is already out....the half the job is already done. Sitko sells the springs and pins.


The motor should look like this at the end of the day.