Can anyone identify this machine?

[7309]

C5.jpg (75.3 KiB) Viewed 2013 times

C4.jpg (71.01 KiB) Viewed 2013 times

C3.jpg (74.96 KiB) Viewed 2013 times

C2.jpg (81.08 KiB) Viewed 2013 times

C1.jpg (83.37 KiB) Viewed 2013 times

I purchased this phonograph a few days ago at auction from Texas. It has no name or number anywhere on it. Since I mainly collect Edison, I am stumped as to who made it. It is fully functional and the lid is actually the wooden base plate which is simply turned over with a handle on it. This is similar to European machines so that is why I placed it in the European phonograph section. Someone there thought it was a "Crown" which I am unfamiliar with. They suggested it might not be European and to place my request in the domestic machines section which I have now done. Well, I hope that I might get some additional information about it. Please check it out and give me your feedback. It will be very welcome. Thanks!

[phonogfp]

The machine is definitely European. Although outwardly similar to a Crown, the pictured machine does not conform to known examples or advertisements of the Crown. An article on the Crown appeared on pages 9-11 of the September 2015 issue of The Antique Phonograph. Known Crowns feature an oxidized finish, exposed gearing behind the belt, a Graphophone-type carriage/lift lever, 4 holes in the end of the mandrel, and different decoration on the cabinet.

Then pictured machine varies in all these respects, but the basic construction, placement of screws, etc. certainly suggests the same manufacturer.

George P.

[Phonofreak]

The horn looks like a B & B reproduction horn fitted to the support and reproducer. I wonder if these had those European Aluminum spun horns originally came with these machines.
Harvey Kravitz

[GeorgeDixon]

I believe it is a variation of a Lambert / Excelsior machine. The models did vary, and quite a bit, but the key and the motor shroud give it away, as does the reproducer. I have attached another example.

[JerryVan]

The machine is definitely European. Although outwardly similar to a Crown, the pictured machine does not conform to known examples or advertisements of the Crown. An article on the Crown appeared on pages 9-11 of the September 2015 issue of The Antique Phonograph. Known Crowns feature an oxidized finish, exposed gearing behind the belt, a Graphophone-type carriage/lift lever, 4 holes in the end of the mandrel, and different decoration on the cabinet.

Then pictured machine varies in all these respects, but the basic construction, placement of screws, etc. certainly suggests the same manufacturer.

George P.

Why does it "definitely" have to be European?

[phonogfp]

The machine is definitely European. Although outwardly similar to a Crown, the pictured machine does not conform to known examples or advertisements of the Crown. An article on the Crown appeared on pages 9-11 of the September 2015 issue of The Antique Phonograph. Known Crowns feature an oxidized finish, exposed gearing behind the belt, a Graphophone-type carriage/lift lever, 4 holes in the end of the mandrel, and different decoration on the cabinet.

Then pictured machine varies in all these respects, but the basic construction, placement of screws, etc. certainly suggests the same manufacturer.

George P.

Why does it "definitely" have to be European?

Because its design and construction are consistent with other known European machines. Conversely, it does not resemble any known American talking machines. I meant no offense in my posted observations.

George P.

[JerryVan]

George,

No offense taken. I was thinking this was a Crown, as you too admitted to be reminded of by it's appearance. I have not considered the Crown to be of European manufacture, but maybe I'm wrong in that assumption. However, with that notion in mind, I did not consider this "Crown-like" machine to be European either. Maybe that makes me doubly wrong.

(BTW, I meant no offense either in my questioning of your conclusion.)

[phonogfp]

As Rene Rondeau pointed out in his article referenced above which appeared in The Antique Phonograph, the Crown was imported by the E.S. Pease Co., which disingenuously claimed that the machine was, "Not an imported toy - but a machine embodying all the important features..." Clever wording! As shown in "GeorgeDixon's" post above, the resemblance to Excelsior products (German) is unmistakable.

George P.

[gsphonos]

Hello!

Send an e-mail to Jean-Paul Agnard. He has a couple of these machines, and I have 1. As far as I remember, it was a premium machine given away in the US. I got a copy of an add for this phonograph from Jean-Paul. Problem is, I can't remember where it is. I have attached a copy of the operating instructions. His case and bedplate, and my case and bedplate are exactly the same. Your horn with crane seems to be a variation from what we have, but everything else is the same. I bought mine at a CAPS show and sale in Buena Park, CA, about 15 years ago for $40. It was missing the horn, reproducer, and feedscrew "part." I eventually saw one of these on Ebay, complete, and I bid, and lost. This was back in the day you could see who the winning buyer was. I e-mailed Jean-Paul, and he gave me information about the machine, and was able to make the pieces I was missing, using his original, so I completed my machine.

Does yours have its handle? This is a reversible machine--turn the mechanism upside down, and it fits in its base.

Definitely similar to the Crown, and maybe made by the same manufacturer, but some were given away in the United States!

I have attached a picture of my machine--before I got the replacement parts.

Mike Sorter

PS I was an under-bidder on this machine. I wanted to have all of the original pieces (the ones Jean-Paul made for me). Congratulations on your purchase! It is an unusual, very cheaply made machine, but one I think is really cool!

[gsphonos]

Here is my machine today...pardon the dust!

Mike