Need help identifying a machine

[Edisonfan]

Need some help here? I found a external horn machine, but the plate is not right?


I found it in an antique mall for $395.00

[FellowCollector]

Hope you didn't buy it, Paul. It appears to be put together with spare Columbia parts and others. Hard to tell for sure with the small pictures but the plates on the side may be covering cabinet holes drilled to accommodate other motors but that's just a guess. When you see an obvious internal horn ID plate like this one from a VV-IX Victrola attached to some sort of phonograph with an external horn it's almost surely put together by someone to attract an unsuspecting buyer looking for an external horn phonograph.

Doug

[Edisonfan]

No Doug, I did not buy it. I wanted too know more about, it. Before I decided, if I was going to buy it. Looks like I do not need too now.

[De Soto Frank]

Reproducer is a Columbia "Grand".

Horn looks like a Columbia "peacock"

Arm and back-bracket are probably Columbia, as I don't see any evidence of the U-shaped goose-neck that would be present on a Victor taper-tube.


Platter is NOT Columbia, appears to be Victor, so I would guess that the motor is Victor too.


Not sure about the smaller plates, if there's really any writing on them?


The Victor plate is from a Victrola, so that's definitely bogus.


I wonder if this is an otherwise legit Columbia that was re-powered with a Victor motor and platter, possibly from a Victrola IX ?

It might be worth a second look and some larger photos, particularly of the deck with the platter removed, Back-bracket and horn mounting, close-up of the spindle (Columbia will have a large brass cone that the platter would seat on, Victor will have a straight spindle with a pin protruding form one side.), and the speed and brake controls.

$395 is a stretch, from what I'm seeing, but if the price is negotiable, it might be worth it for some of the parts...

We need to get Harvey Kravitz (phonofreak) to weigh-in on this one...

[Edisonfan]

The incorrect plate tipped me off. As I found out it was from an internal horn machine. I had looked at this before, and the price was $495.00, but it was lowered to $395.00 I took photos so, I could some input from fellow collectors. on here. Thank you for the help!

Paul

...and George F. Paul

[phonogfp]

The incorrect plate tipped me off. As I found out it was from an internal horn machine. I had looked at this before, and the price was $495.00, but it was lowered to $395.00 I took photos so, I could some input from fellow collectors. on here. Thank you for the help!

Paul

...and George F. Paul

Huh?

George P.

[Edisonfan]

I wanted your opinion on the machine I have at the top of the thread. George.

[phonogfp]

Oh. I agree with Doug's and Franks's assessments. I didn't have anything to add, and the small photos don't show much important detail (no back detail at all), so I saw no point in repeating what had already been written.

I also am glad you didn't buy it - -

George P.

[Marco Gilardetti]

The horn looks to me like one of those generic horns that were commonly used in Europe by many many makes, but nevermind: as said previously this gramophone definitely goes under the "Frankenphone" cathegory and is obviously made by a mix & match of heterogeneous parts. It's horrible to say but alas that poor machine should be scrapped, so that its components would be used to bring back to life other genuine machines that need a genuine spare part.

[estott]

The horn looks to me like one of those generic horns that were commonly used in Europe by many many makes, but nevermind: as said previously this gramophone definitely goes under the "Frankenphone" cathegory and is obviously made by a mix & match of heterogeneous parts. It's horrible to say but alas that poor machine should be scrapped, so that its components would be used to bring back to life other genuine machines that need a genuine spare part.

Columbia imported a quantity of these horns and other European components shortly before WWI- I believe they were specially made with the Columbia threaded fitting. If the horn, arm, and back bracket are in good condition there could be some value in them.

The case doesn't look like a Victor case, the mouldings aren't right. It could be a cheap external horn case, maybe even a cheap Columbia case. A look at the motor would help.