Identify 2 gramophones

[napovo]

The tonearm really looks like one from a later 20s Columbia portable.

I think it's a "frankophone", a mix of somewhat period parts crafted together to make a machine.

Here is my 100% original and genuine 1929 UK Columbia 2a Horn Model with Plano-Reflex tonearm and No.9 soundbox.

http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... +2a#p90209

Thank you for your photos. The tonearm on your original one look very similar to the tonearm on mine. Can we say that that foldable tonearm is not only on portable models?
Any idea on the brass horn on my Columbia model? Is it a genuine one?

Any idea on the one with blue horn? I can say that is made by oak and is very very heavy.

Thank you

[epigramophone]

The Plano-Reflex tonearm was standardised across the UK Columbia machine range from the 1928/29 season.

The Columbia 2a horn is painted steel, but some earlier models had seamless brass horns and your machine may have been retrospectively fitted with one of these. From your pictures the horn appears to be nickel plated and looks very smart.

[napovo]

Thank you very much.
Anyone has idea on the heavy one with blue horn? The wood logo on the cabinet looks like a royal cup with decoration.
Thank you

[Hailey]

Neither machine is legitimate. The value of both combined is zero.

[Inigo]

And the second one... Could be a franken... or not. Some off brand German companies (or swiss, or from elsewhere in central Europe) used wood for parts the tonearm, etc.
And in case it would be a frankenphone, it is very well made, and seems to work well. It has been made with love and care. The metal applications on the wooden support are a fine detail.
It depends on the price also.
We tend to be suspicious about off brand machines, forced by the bad experience with the Indian crapopohones. But we must open our minds and judge the value of a machine by its attention to detail and good design. I've been lately watching thousands of photos of Spanish Gramophones and European ones, and the is a fascinating population of models, ones are off brand, and others are locally made variations of the well known main brands. If only the prestigious Spanish, German and French branches of hmv made their own models, different from the main stream and not available in the uk or in the States (Victor). And there was the myriad of Gramophone makers across all Europe. Only in Spain there were at least ten major local gramophone makers out of the three grands. And they made good Gramophones and 90 years after, we can see the proof of their endurance and that they were sold by the thousands. In this country we had a terrible civil war that destroyed and abused everything during three long devastating years (1936-39). And so many of these machines have survived...!
I really cringe at the very conscience of how many of these original Spanish machines I've passed by for years, just thinking they were frankencrapophones! And I'm now sure that many of them were authentic! Lots of adverts in magazines or newspapers, and on the record sleeves, are the testimony. If this is the case for Spain alone, imagine the enormous population of rare machines made in such other European countries with much more people and powerful industries...
So this second machine could be perfectly a rare original! Who knows...?

[epigramophone]

Neither machine is legitimate. The value of both combined is zero.

How rude.

[Phono48]

Neither machine is legitimate. The value of both combined is zero.

Hardly the sort of remark worthy of this forum, especially as it has been proven beyond doubt that the Columbia machine is 100% genuine.

[Hailey]

Neither machine is legitimate. The value of both combined is zero.

I was just informed by another collector regarding the “quoted” comment above. My sincere apologies to the author of this thread. The aforementioned post, seemingly originating from myself, was in fact, entered by my nephew. At a previous point in time, I had entrusted him, in my absence when I had no capability of logging into the Forum, to follow a thread that I was interested in and forward pertinent information to me. In doing so, he had my log on information. Recently, he developed a “marginal” interest in collecting, and now has a bit of a chip on his shoulder due to me not dealing a rare machine to him that is way beyond his means. As I have now learned, his vendetta included making a few comments on social media to deface me.
The context of this “quoted” comment is not representative of my character whatsoever. Admittedly, I can be critical concerning certain facets of our hobby, yet that comment reaches far beyond the boundaries of even this old guys opinion. If the truth be known, I have a distinct favor towards the Columbia machine with the fluted columns, as it is representative of the last of the line of outside horn machines offered in the UK as my memory has it.
As for the domestic issue that has created this embarrassment, I can assure you that it has been handled on my end.

[Jerry B.]

I was just informed by another collector regarding the “quoted” comment above. My sincere apologies to the author of this thread. The aforementioned post, seemingly originating from myself, was in fact, entered by my nephew. At a previous point in time, I had entrusted him, in my absence when I had no capability of logging into the Forum, to follow a thread that I was interested in and forward pertinent information to me. In doing so, he had my log on information. Recently, he developed a “marginal” interest in collecting, and now has a bit of a chip on his shoulder due to me not dealing a rare machine to him that is way beyond his means. As I have now learned, his vendetta included making a few comments on social media to deface me.
The context of this “quoted” comment is not representative of my character whatsoever. Admittedly, I can be critical concerning certain facets of our hobby, yet that comment reaches far beyond the boundaries of even this old guys opinion. If the truth be known, I have a distinct favor towards the Columbia machine with the fluted columns, as it is representative of the last of the line of outside horn machines offered in the UK as my memory has it.
As for the domestic issue that has created this embarrassment, I can assure you that it has been handled on my end.

Thank you for the explanation. It explains a lot. I have been to your home and enjoyed the visit very much. The rude post seemed out of character and I am glad to learn the truth.

Jerry Blais

[OrthoFan]

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