Edison Phonograph, approximate value?

[drh]

I think you did right to skip that Standard, which was no bargain and appears to have been in less than grand shape--I especially didn't like the way someone had cut wood out in the rear for a horn crane rod.

That said, I'm going to be a bit of a dissenting voice about Amberolas. They are nice machines--an Amberola 75 that I bought last year right here on the forum must be the quietest-running cylinder machine I've ever encountered--but they cannot play anything, 2 or 4 minute, made of wax, and inevitably you will want to play something or other on a wax cylinder. Hence, I'd advise against starting with one. I'd agree that a combination 2-minute/4-minute machine is the way to go. As to the fragility of wax cylinders, yes, they are prone to mold and breakage, but I started out with them on a machine not unlike the one that started this thread (in my case, 2-minute only Standard model B), and I played 2-minute wax cylinders for years with loads of pleasure. In all that time, I had only one case of breakage. That said, I was never happier than when I snared a 2/4 converter kit for it and got the capacity to play 4-minute wax cylinders as well, one machine to play everything. (By that point I had a somewhat worse-for-wear Amberola 50, but as noted that still left me unable to play wax Amberols, and frankly it didn't sound all that great--probably needed a reproducer rebuilding job).

[nostalgia]

Thank you for more inputs, it is highly appreciated.
When talking about 2min/ 4 min machines for wax cylinders, are some models made this way or are they only later on converted to play both?
Any suggestion about decent machines being able to play both 2 min/4 min wax cylinders, is again very much appreciated.

[epigramophone]

Edison did not believe in built in obsolescence, so when he introduced an improvement he sold the necessary parts to enable owners of older phonographs to update them. My 1901 Triumph model A is a good example of a machine which has been continuously updated.

It has the combination gearing to enable it to play 2 and 4 minute cylinders (1908) the 11 panel Cygnet horn (1909) and the Diamond B reproducer to enable it to play Blue Amberol cylinders (1912). These improvements became standard equipment on machines made after their introduction.

[gramophoneshane]

I'd also recommend buying a combination 2-4 min machine of whatever model you like and can afford, but I'd also recommend getting one with the larger horizontal carriage.
That way you can gradually buy all the different reproducers to make that one machine capable of playing every 2 or 4 minute cylinder that was ever produced, whether it's brown or black wax, celluloid or even modern resin.

A machine with a horizontal carriage and a Diamond B reproducer will get the best sound quality from celluloid records, and it can be used on both 2M and 4M celluloid records.
And by using the appropriate reproducer with a sapphire stylus, and adaptor ring in the horizontal carriage, you can then play 2 min black or brown wax, and 4 min black wax

Personally I think the best cylinder era music is on wax cylinders, with perhaps the exception of the hot jazz that was put on celluloid at the very end of the cylinder era, some of which now sell for several hundred dollar because they are so rare and desirable.

Yes, wax cylinders can suffer from issues like mold and breakage, but they don't have to.
I still have a lot of the first 2 & 4 min wax cylinders I ever bought 30-40+ years ago, and they now look and play as good as the day I got them. So they're really not as fragile and troublesome as some would have you believe.

And all celluloid cylinders, like Blue Amberols, come with their own set of problems as well. Blue Amberols can suffer plaster loss from the core, or the plaster can swell causing the celluloid to split, or perhaps the most common problem of all, the celluloid shrinks, so it skip grooves during playback, or is out of round, or again can cause splits.
So celluloid cylinders aren't as indestructible as some people make out either.

[Curt A]

Shane's right, I'm biased... I've hated wax cylinders since I accidentally broke an expensive black wax title.
So, take my comments with that in mind.

[AmberolaAndy]

Shane's right, I'm biased... I've hated wax cylinders since I accidentally broke an expensive black wax title.
So, take my comments with that in mind.

Was it a wax amberol title?

Judging by the looks of this machine, The lever lift, the serial number on the knife’s edge, this machine was likely made in 1902! (May 1902?)

[nostalgia]

Thanks again for more inputs and suggestions everyone.
When we talk about machines that can play both 2 min and 4 min wax rolls, I am still confused though. I don't even remember if only Edison made these machines?
If it is possible, please give me some exact names on cylinder phonographs that can play both 2 and 4 min cylinders in different price ranges...., remember...I am all blank onsuch phonographs,,,even if I am almost daily dissecting disc HMV machines Columbias and also some Victrolas, Odeon etc

[Curt A]

Columbia made some nice 2/4 minute cylinder machines, although they aren't as common to find with the 2/4 gearing as Edison machines. Also, some of the Columbia machines have problematic pot metal parts, which you don't have to worry about with Edison machines, so some research is necessary before buying one. My favorites are 2/4 min BE and BF Columbia machines - no pot metal, but not all of them are 2/4 min.

[AmberolaAndy]

Columbia made some nice 2/4 minute cylinder machines, although they aren't as common to find with the 2/4 gearing as Edison machines. Also, some of the Columbia machines have problematic pot metal parts, which you don't have to worry about with Edison machines, so some research is necessary before buying one. My favorites are 2/4 min BE and BF Columbia machines - no pot metal, but not all of them are 2/4 min.

Some Columbia BE machines had 4 minute gearing? How can you tell your Columbia
machine has 4 min gearing?

[Lucius1958]

Columbia made some nice 2/4 minute cylinder machines, although they aren't as common to find with the 2/4 gearing as Edison machines. Also, some of the Columbia machines have problematic pot metal parts, which you don't have to worry about with Edison machines, so some research is necessary before buying one. My favorites are 2/4 min BE and BF Columbia machines - no pot metal, but not all of them are 2/4 min.

Some Columbia BE machines had 4 minute gearing? How can you tell your Columbia
machine has 4 min gearing?

There is usually a knob on the left side.

Columbia, however, had gone over to celluloid cylinders by that time; so the "combination" reproducer they offered is not really suited to wax cylinders, imho.

- Bill